Without wanting to start an argument here, Im just curious as to what people want to vote or if they haven't made up their minds.

Business as usual mate. I was actually outside the Houses of Parliament yesterday and it just looked like a sunny afternoon with tourists everywhere taking pictures.

That's not quite correct. Open borders within the EU means that ANYONE entitled to be in the EU (either by being a EU citizen or via having a Schengen visa) is free to move about it as they please. Borders exist, as they do when entering or exiting the UK because we are not party to the Schengen agreement (we opted out along with Ireland as well as us having the choice to opt out of the Euro - in fact we got almost everything we wanted from the EU when our own bills were passed). So the only real EU borders are those round their coast territorial waters and then obviously those bordering non EU states.

If that is the case Si, how do all the camps in France exist?

Surely the people trying to get to the UK have come into the EU and managed to get from where they entered right to the french coast. If some came in through Turkey and Greece..... how did they pass through the borders into France with no passports?

From wikipedia, "In 2016, border controls were temporarily introduced in six Schengen countries (Austria, Denmark, France, Germany, Norway and Sweden)."

I have No problem with migrant workers contributing to our country or people entering if they will be harmed returning to their native country at all...

I am just dismayed that Governments do nothing to help people to stay in their own country with proper support, kindness and some bloody compassion....

It seems a lot of people see the media saying that we are being swamped with immigrants and lump, refugees, migrant workers or anyone coming into the UK as all the same..... They aren't!

Seeing 'Frog face' Farrage pointing at a stream of desperate people on a bill board made me bloody sick..... Desperate, homeless families...... what did our forefathers fight against in WWII.... this kind of propaganda and demonising people!

Sorry....... so sick of media Bull...........

Personally think this is balls and I disagree with the tone. However I can see how it could be the case.

http://indy100.independent.co.uk/article/people-are-really-really-hoping-this-theory-about-david-cameron-and-brexit-is-true--bJhqBql0VZ?utm_source=indy&utm_medium=top5&utm_campaign=i100

Love this thread.. Always really interesting to see/read other peoples point of view. I am Scottish, and been on this planet for almost 55 years.

Consider myself a reasonably educated individual. Yes I have my faults/opinions/outbursts !

Did I vote leave or remain ? I voted leave.

At the last Indy vote did I vote yes or no ??? I voted no.

 

My opinion ? For what its worth ?

 

I would prefer a United Kingdom/Great Britian. Yes I have my opinions and reasons, but this is a car forum.

 

Religion, Sport and Politics, they are very much like a Penis ???

Fine to have, but please don't wave it in my face !!

 

Just my 2p`s worth.

Peace, love and hugs to all.

 

Alan....

If that is the case Si, how do all the camps in France exist?

Surely the people trying to get to the UK have come into the EU and managed to get from where they entered right to the french coast. If some came in through Turkey and Greece..... how did they pass through the borders into France with no passports?

From wikipedia, "In 2016, border controls were temporarily introduced in six Schengen countries (Austria, Denmark, France, Germany, Norway and Sweden)."

I have No problem with migrant workers contributing to our country or people entering if they will be harmed returning to their native country at all...

I am just dismayed that Governments do nothing to help people to stay in their own country with proper support, kindness and some bloody compassion....

It seems a lot of people see the media saying that we are being swamped with immigrants and lump, refugees, migrant workers or anyone coming into the UK as all the same..... They aren't!

Seeing 'Frog face' Farrage pointing at a stream of desperate people on a bill board made me bloody sick..... Desperate, homeless families...... what did our forefathers fight against in WWII.... this kind of propaganda and demonising people!

Sorry....... so sick of media Bull...........

 

I think you're missing my point slightly Russ. You can't close the borders to stop the immigrants as the majority (by a HUGE margin) need the free access and are entitled to it.

 

Farage is a stupid ****! :lol:

Told you Boris won't be PM.

I'm not a Farage fan, however I do see some use in the man. Firstly he is a cut throat *******, he's a banker through and through. That strength of character is something that many of these pampered princes we call politicians don't possess. Regardless of that quality, let's face it 98% of them are bent and selfish.

What he does best is stir the pot and argue the toss. One of those never back down pig heads. All this business lately is the result of bubbling discontent for years. I genuinely believe recent event are good for Britian and further more the EU. It's forced a very arrogant bunch of people to pay some attention to their long ignored electrate. Calls today for heads of state to discuss things with Britian alone as the EU commission is actually making talks worse are a great example. Some times you need a good fire.

 

Would farage make a good PM, hell to the no! Would he make a good opposition leader, Damn right. Currently my money is on Teresa May to become the new PM. She's a head strong lady and I think we may see the Iron Lady mk2. Britian needs some *****cks right now.

I'm not a Farage fan, however I do see some use in the man. Firstly he is a cut throat *******, he's a banker through and through. That strength of character is something that many of these pampered princes we call politicians don't possess. Regardless of that quality, let's face it 98% of them are bent and selfish.

What he does best is stir the pot and argue the toss. One of those never back down pig heads. All this business lately is the result of bubbling discontent for years. I genuinely believe recent event are good for Britian and further more the EU. It's forced a very arrogant bunch of people to pay some attention to their long ignored electrate. Calls today for heads of state to discuss things with Britian alone as the EU commission is actually making talks worse are a great example. Some times you need a good fire.

 

Would farage make a good PM, hell to the no! Would he make a good opposition leader, Damn right. Currently my money is on Teresa May to become the new PM. She's a head strong lady and I think we may see the Iron Lady mk2. Britian needs some *****cks right now.

 

Hail Mrs Thatcher number 2...:bow::bow:..Actually theres a bit of over acting there but i see it as the lesser of 2 evils:yes:

I'm not a Farage fan, however I do see some use in the man. Firstly he is a cut throat *******, he's a banker through and through. That strength of character is something that many of these pampered princes we call politicians don't possess. Regardless of that quality, let's face it 98% of them are bent and selfish.

What he does best is stir the pot and argue the toss. One of those never back down pig heads. All this business lately is the result of bubbling discontent for years. I genuinely believe recent event are good for Britian and further more the EU. It's forced a very arrogant bunch of people to pay some attention to their long ignored electrate. Calls today for heads of state to discuss things with Britian alone as the EU commission is actually making talks worse are a great example. Some times you need a good fire.

 

Would farage make a good PM, hell to the no! Would he make a good opposition leader, Damn right. Currently my money is on Teresa May to become the new PM. She's a head strong lady and I think we may see the Iron Lady mk2. Britian needs some *****cks right now.

 

Well said - and damn right on Teresa May. She gets my vote too....:thumbup:

Currently my money is on Teresa May to become the new PM. She's a head strong lady and I think we may see the Iron Lady mk2. Britian needs some *****cks right now.

 

She certainly seems to have a track record. Make of this what you will:

 

http://order-order.com/2016/07/02/read-full-article-pulled-telegraph-pressure-may-campaign/

Here's a thought for you.

We will soon have a new and unelected PM, the opposition is in complete disarray.

There is the possibility that the new PM will call a snap general election as Labour are in such a mess on the assumption that victory is assured.

The Liberal Democrats meanwhile have quietly announced that their election manifesto is essentially to remain in the EU regardless of the referendum vote.

16 million voted to remain, which is more than have ever voted for the winning party in a general election.

Interesting times.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]98778[/ATTACH]

Just occasionally you see something which just gets funnier every time you look at it

Here's a thought for you.

We will soon have a new and unelected PM, the opposition is in complete disarray.

There is the possibility that the new PM will call a snap general election as Labour are in such a mess on the assumption that victory is assured.

The Liberal Democrats meanwhile have quietly announced that their election manifesto is essentially to remain in the EU regardless of the referendum vote.

16 million voted to remain, which is more than have ever voted for the winning party in a general election.

Interesting times.

 

That's not quite technically correct. We (the public) voted for a Conservative government, the Conservative party elected David Cameron and as such will elect their new leader. Being as we don't have a presidential system your not supposed to be voting for the party leader per say in a general election.

Any attempt to vito the referendum result by any party will spark huge discontent and social unrest by both the democratic winning side (leave) and those whole believe in democracy.

 

What should happen IMO, is that Jean Claude should resign and proper talks should commence amongst the actual elected heads of the EU states to agree a suitable outcome to what is not just a British concern by a global concern. Get the bearucrats out the way and let democratically appointed national leaders talk.

That's not quite technically correct. We (the public) voted for a Conservative government, the Conservative party elected David Cameron and as such will elect their new leader. Being as we don't have a presidential system your not supposed to be voting for the party leader per say in a general election.

Any attempt to vito the referendum result by any party will spark huge discontent and social unrest by both the democratic winning side (leave) and those whole believe in democracy.

 

What should happen IMO, is that Jean Claude should resign and proper talks should commence amongst the actual elected heads of the EU states to agree a suitable outcome to what is not just a British concern by a global concern. Get the bearucrats out the way and let democratically appointed national leaders talk.

That will never happen Steve in a 100 years...it goes against the whole ethos of what the EU is about,and more sneakly than openly...one controlling figure head for every country across the Westen central belt right up to Russia,all with the same laws and currency..Unfortantly its not going to plan atm:rofl::rofl:

Sadly Bri your right.

That's not quite technically correct. We (the public) voted for a Conservative government, the Conservative party elected David Cameron and as such will elect their new leader. Being as we don't have a presidential system your not supposed to be voting for the party leader per say in a general election.

Any attempt to vito the referendum result by any party will spark huge discontent and social unrest by both the democratic winning side (leave) and those whole believe in democracy.

 

What should happen IMO, is that Jean Claude should resign and proper talks should commence amongst the actual elected heads of the EU states to agree a suitable outcome to what is not just a British concern by a global concern. Get the bearucrats out the way and let democratically appointed national leaders talk.

At the top you say how the PM is not directly elected but chosen by the MPs that we vote for.

Then at the bottom call EU people unelected. Well they're elected in the same way the PM is, we vote for MEPs, they vote for a leader.

 

This whole "unelected bureaucrats" thing is largely a myth, as I think most people would not call the PM "unelected" in the same way.

 

It's almost as bad as the old "Brussels bossing us around" line...

The trouble is chris they aren't elected by us and we have no control over them as a whole. Whilst we may indeed elect our own MEPs they are a minority in the mix. Meaning the majority of those there deciding our fate are not elected by British citizens directly. It's bad enough having a group of toffs in charge that don't understand everyday people without it being a bunch of forgin toffs who don't understand or particularly like "the bloody English" (ignoring the fact we're not all even English). There's about 800 of these MEPs throughout the EU and we have about 70 who get shouted down quite quickly, 10% of the room is difficult to make yourself heard, esp when no one wants to listen.

Tbh I'm not a big fan of the current process in any event and would like to see us move to a different model.

Whilst this is all true, you could argue by the same logic that Cornwall should leave the UK as they only have a small percentage of the votes that lead to their government, and all those people all over the rest of the country don't understand what it's like living in Cornwall, which they quite possibly don't, and they just get bossed around by everyone else, which they quite possibly do. You've got to draw the line somewhere, wherever you think that is.

 

I think this is what's happening with the north recently, they think "Westminster" is too far away, don't like being bossed around by them and think they're out of touch with the north.

Another one bits the dust. (again)

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nigel-farage-resigns-as-ukip-leader-a7118626.html

You certainly could descend down to a point where every man woman and child has to turn up to Westminster, that's obviously not practical. As you say you have to draw a line some where and I think the very least we should be prepared with is within our own national government who are directed by the regions for their peoples. There is in my mind no reason for Europe to have a say in what Cornish farmers or London bankers do directly. In matters where they work together talks are required but that's what happens perfectly successfully outside the EU. It's a layer of politics that exists to exist. The EU is simply topical, it is however just one of a chunk of public sector jobs that solely exist to give the finically elite a way to give there mate a cushtie job. Literally jobs for the boys.

 

The "North South divide" thing is a funny one, usually perpetuated by London and the North. The south west is just as poor and just as marginised and ignored as the North. Have a little look at a motorway map and you will soon see where the infrastructure and subsequently investment is.

Edited July 4, 20169 yr by Stephen

Another one bits the dust. (again)

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nigel-farage-resigns-as-ukip-leader-a7118626.html

 

Maybe a bit premature but good, he has done what he set out to do. Maybe it's time to disband UKIP as a whole.