Makes me wonder after reading this:-

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article6838691.ece

A despairing mother killed herself and her disabled daughter by setting her car on fire after enduring a relentless campaign of abuse from a gang of youths.

Unable to cope with the torment Fiona Pilkington, 38, drove with 18-year-old daughter Francecca Hardwick to a lay-by with a 10-litre can of petrol.

The single mother then doused old clothes in the back of the blue Austin Maestro before setting light to it with her daughter and herself still inside.

 

Some comments, all of which, I agree with:-

 

max martin wrote:

 

This story is so very sad. These poor, vulnerable people had an intolerable life but this is the way things are going in Great Britain. It seems a lost battle to try to protect the weak. As a senior teacher, I have worked hard all my life in the fight against bullies and this moral decline. Now I hate my home country so much that I have moved to Portugal. In the countryside, it is like stepping back 50 years. Here there is still respect for others and old fashioned moral values. Here it is the old people who hang around on street benches and they keep an eye out for other. If someones children behaved so unthinkably badly like this, then they would be told, be ashamed and certainly be expected to do something about their disgusting offspring. Sorry to leave a sinking ship but I have earned it.

 

rudolf schwarzkopf-zskai wrote:

 

I used to live in Nottingham, where I endured years of hooliganism, vandalism to cars and houses, graffiti, mugging of my visitors, stones through my windows, kids ruining my garden. I leant quickly not to engage with this sub-species of low life, as this would lead to more trouble for me in the long run. The Tony Martin case was the turning point for me, when I realized clear as crystal that British people are not truly free to live in freedom as I understand that word to mean. I was living in a form of enslavement to these local yobs, where they ruled the turf, and I skulked behind curtains in my house in a state of semi-siege.

 

Five years ago I was fortunate in that I was able to take up an emloyment offer in Houston, Texas. What a difference!! I have never been woken up in the night by the sound of breaking glass, or the eerie light of a car set on fire, the pavements are not smeared wih dog mess, there's no graffiti, and should a Texan catch an intruder in his house and shoot him, it's rare a grand jury would consider pressing charges.

 

When my British friends sit and sneer about the vulgarity of the US, specifically 'the guns and the violence', they have not a single clue what they are talking about. I'm now in the process of getting my papers to stay here permanently, and stories like the one you have carried today confirm more than ever my sadness at the inability of UK to shake itself out of this do-gooding-the-criminal-is-just-a-misunderstood-victim-of-society ethos.

 

 

Alexis Thompson wrote:

 

I'm glad I'm living in America after reading this story. Bad things happen here but we as people or as a community are not held hostage by bullies. We have self defence laws, neighorhood watches, policy that actually show up and administer justice of some sort. If all else fails, record them doing the horrid things they did by camera or even by cell phone then take the film to a lawyer and sue the living daylights out of em. :-) Got to love the American way

 

David Varcoe wrote:

 

I have read this article in despair at the continuing saga of feral youth behaviour in UK, the lack of strong police presence and responsibility of parents.

 

It has to be recognised there is a sub species of ignorant,non working benefit claiming adults in UK whose standards, or rather lack of, pass on to their children - not that this excuses them.

 

UK is reaping the inevitable consequences of a weak, soft, ill lead society divided by "us and them".

 

I grew up in the 70's and this sort of thing was virtually unimaginable even that recently.

 

I am utterly appalled at what Britain has become - those responsible for its care and its future should hang their heads in shame. Within 70 years, the greatest country on earth has been reduced to an over-crowded lawless shadow. The heart of the greatest Empire in history is now nothing more than a puppet

There is a reason why all this crap is tolerated.

Why do you think i personnally wanna move to America, i also know a few others who would move there. Personnally for me i have had the best of both worlds, i have been over there many times and still to this day perfer it, as soon as i get a job over there i will be leaving.

Why do you think i personnally wanna move to America, i also know a few others who would move there. Personnally for me i have had the best of both worlds, i have been over there many times and still to this day perfer it, as soon as i get a job over there i will be leaving.

 

thats word for word what i would have said.

Makes me feel sick............... If she would have gone out and given one of them a clip round the ear, the police would have been round like a shot........ to arrest her...................... this country has gone mad:rant::rant:

very sad story and i know only what was written so take it at face value, but i think this lady was clearly mentally ill and wickedly selfish to end her childs life because she couldnt cope there seems to be no evidence her adult child agreed to a suicide pact, only recently someone i knew very well doused herself in petrol and ended her life, mercifully she took none of her children with her but her long standing mental health issues were never dealt with. i feel there is a rise in highly sensitive children (maybe brought on by neurotic parents?) who for reasons best known to themselves become or feel persecuted by people they dont even speak too and all too often where the rough and tumble of life would be brushed off cant let go of these feelings and they develop in to deep-seated fear of others and their intentions, school teachers i know are inundated with parents complaing that kid X said or looked funny at my child and they feel very scared hurt etc etc. its as if the threshold for interaction has been lowered by some very soft/sensitive people, dont get me wrong i have lived in a beruit style street and stressful as it was being confronted by other peoples lifestyles we never got our sense of proportion distorted by these incidences

Story aside, I fully agree with the essence of the thread.

 

What we need is former New York Mayor Giuliani's zero tolerance policy. Sure, there will be some innocent victims, but unfortunately that's a price that has to be paid.

 

The level of hooliganism and bad behaviour IN SOME PARTS OF THE UK is appalling, but then it's been allowed to get that way and still, no one is prepared to do anything about it.

 

This is why today we have a society that because of fear, will not interject if it sees people being raped, murdered, bullied or harrassed.

In Belfast there are some rough gettos but I would rather live in them than some inner city areas in England, the PSNI are very good hear but if they dont sort it out it is sorted out very quickley by the locals

rudolf schwarzkopf-zskai wrote:

 

I used to live in Nottingham, where I endured years of hooliganism, vandalism to cars and houses, graffiti, mugging of my visitors, stones through my windows, kids ruining my garden. I leant quickly not to engage with this sub-species of low life, as this would lead to more trouble for me in the long run.

 

I occasionally have to work in one of the known "hot spots" of inner city Nottingham. I am also on occasion drafted in to a similar area in Derby.

Now the truth is that it can be intimidating and there are indeed substantial numbers of low life and criminals. ( I would know cos I deal with them). They are a MINORITY element tho.

HOWEVER there is still an overwhelming majority of decent people living in these areas. I also deal with them.

We dont have all the facts to hand in this sad case and we shouldnt condemn whole areas of society on the actions of a few.

IMO of course

Just been discussing moving away tonight. I would be off today, but the missus wouldn't go.

 

The country has gone down the pan.

 

Have you seen what you can get in the US for £100K

For evil to flourish, good men may only do nothing.

 

Old saying with plenty of truth in it.

But tainted slightly when the evil/scum/degenerates, delete as applicable,

are sometimes rewarded/protected/feared, again DAA.

 

Personal view here is the country as a whole is maybe just a wee bit too soft/lenient ?

 

Whats the cure, havent a clue as every case is different, but there is one thing for certain, Great Britian is no longer great !:(

 

Overheard one of the young lads at our place discussing getting tooled up for a Saturday night. His advice to a newcomer was, and I quote;

 

If you gotta use the blade, stab him at least 10 times. If you stab him once and he dies its murder. Stab him multiple times and its Manslaughter. Worse case scenario, you will be out in 3 years ! :shock:

 

He is 19 by the way !

 

Alan.................

Is inner-city Britain the worst place on earth to live?

No.

I grew up in the East End of London in the 1970s and it was fine then. In fact I loved my childhood there. Sure, it became a bit rough during the 1980s but I believe it gave me the "life experience" that contributed (positively) to some of the skills I posess today.

 

However it got progressively worse throughout the late 1980s and 1990s and now I'm pleased to have moved on to a more "sheltered life" in rural Buckinghamshire.

 

My folks still live in Leyton today - heaven knows why - and it's a complete shite-hole. Whilst I like to go and visit my parents, I absolutely hate the area now and, once outside the (perceived) safety of my family's home, I cannot get out of London fast enough.

 

Richard:)

I'm based in London now but only for career's sake...giving it a few years to get a nice little nest egg and then I'm out to the coutryside where people still care about each other! I'll be fooked if I'm going to start a family surrounded by chavs!

Hell no .

Edited September 19, 200916 yr by Slowhand

I'm sure war-torn Mogadishu or Rwanda are probably worse places to live.

I'm sure war-torn Mogadishu or Rwanda are probably worse places to live.

 

yea but its all relative..someone does you bad you can go to the cuboard and pull out your AK47 unlike good ole blighty were you cant do jack shit to defend ones rights and were its atually frowned upon to even open your mouth if some cokhead is damaging your property or threating family members:(...having said that i have'nt called the police for about 25 years as i find plan B is more effective;). Its the old and vunerable i feel sorry for in this secpit we call modern Britain

i had some trouble a while back with noisey neighbours, i dealt with it in my own way as the police said it wasnt really a police matter

 

its the pc nature we live by that has fooked this country up, a copper should be allwoed to clip a young kid for no other reason but to strike fear into them

i had some trouble a while back with noisey neighbours, i dealt with it in my own way as the police said it wasnt really a police matter

 

its the pc nature we live by that has fooked this country up, a copper should be allwoed to clip a young kid for no other reason but to strike fear into them

 

Ahhhh the old paint tin on a string through the window if I'm not mistaken........:rofl:

 

You're right though Allan......fooking country has gone down the U-bend:mad:

 

Richard:headvswal

There is a problem for sure, it seems to me the government gives too much help (money) to people that dont want to work to buy their vote, these tend to be the thieving low moral scum that cause these problems, if this money was diverted to the police and they were given proper power to deal with them it would help start turning things round, but then they risk not winning the next election which is more important for them than the problems as they dont live with it day after day in their country retreat.

I shook two kids up good and proper today, I was repairing a fence went off to get some bits and saw three youths walking away from the opening in the fence, suspecting they were up to no good I looked around to find they had nicked my hammer, so I jumped in the car drove down the road saw them with the hammer in their grimy little hands grabbed the two biggest ones and shook them about, according to my daughter who was standing next to me the third on was shaking like a leaf, I told them i do not want to see them walking past my house again then flung them away............. I am so praying their parents will turn up at my doorstep to complain.................

just sell them a mac 1 destroyer and you wil will fine lol

very sad story and i know only what was written so take it at face value, but i think this lady was clearly mentally ill and wickedly selfish to end her childs life because she couldnt cope there seems to be no evidence her adult child agreed to a suicide pact, only recently someone i knew very well doused herself in petrol and ended her life, mercifully she took none of her children with her but her long standing mental health issues were never dealt with. i feel there is a rise in highly sensitive children (maybe brought on by neurotic parents?) who for reasons best known to themselves become or feel persecuted by people they dont even speak too and all too often where the rough and tumble of life would be brushed off cant let go of these feelings and they develop in to deep-seated fear of others and their intentions, school teachers i know are inundated with parents complaing that kid X said or looked funny at my child and they feel very scared hurt etc etc. its as if the threshold for interaction has been lowered by some very soft/sensitive people, dont get me wrong i have lived in a beruit style street and stressful as it was being confronted by other peoples lifestyles we never got our sense of proportion distorted by these incidences

 

I agree partly with the fact that she shouldn't have taken her daughter's life, but apparently she did it because she was scared that she might continue alone to suffer at the hands of those thugs. She WAS mentally ill, but it's hardly surprising after 15 years of torment. Some interesting comments on here and I think the conclusion is that if you are fit enough to police your own street, then do so, but very carefully and until you've emigrated to a nicer place! Oh and I suppose at least some of us are old enough to remember a time when you were proud to be British. Hold on to those memories while all our remaining industry vanishes and we are bred out of our own country.

Edited September 20, 200916 yr by DaveMac

Dave Mac, What do you mean by bred out of our own country ?

possibly something to do with immagrants coming over here and over populating our country to such a point where we are no longer a british isle but a multi cultured isle????

The rise of the ' mohammed' .

Apparently no.3 most popular english name.

I have no problem with poles, asians, whatever (The mrs says i dislike most people anyways, regardless of race :rofl: )

The thing i do hate is numbers.

Why should i be a minority in many of my local towns?

 

We should be able to defend ourselves in our own homes, i should be able to take kids out of mums garden, who have climbed over a 6 ' high wall to retrive their ball + deposit them in front of a shame faced mother to explain why they shouldnt trample through her vegetables. But they just shout 'you cant touch me '

 

rant rant moan :rant::rant: