BIGSSS Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 Just has the Police at my door and charged me on having no tax, no insurance and no MOT. I bought my Z as a project to keep me occupied as i have a bad heart and don't work anymore. Now the car is on SORN and as it don't move as the engine and gearbox is out i haven't bothered with insurance as its off the road and going no where. I have had it parked up at the front of my house off the road where i have been working on it when i can, but the Police say it still counts as on the road even though in the pics you can see its off the road and not obstructing traffic. Any help and advice as to where i stand on this is much appreciated as i genuinly thought i was doing nothing wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaffaZ32 Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 It is on a public footpath i guess. that could be your angle as i'm sure it states the car has to be off a public highway to be compliant with the Sorn regulations which it is as it's a public footpath. The area look quite, something makes me think some goon reported you otherwise the feds probably wouldn't of bothered. I think you have a case so fight it don't accept it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uno Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 Looking at it the area where the car is parked, is i think, part of the carriageway (highway) and technically you're not off road there bud...just my initial thought...sorry not more positive try getting a definition from the highways agency..or local authority on this section of road to be 100% but if IIRC the pavement or boarder areas parking bays, lay-bys etc etc are all considered part of the (whole) carriageway and as such not private land....there are some private strips and verges in the odd place but thats usually marked as such or you find them adjacent to old properties (pre war etc)...your local area looks newer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 300zx_girl Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 The SORN procedures which apply to all vehicles taxed on or after 31 Jan 1998 require vehicle keepers to notify DVLA whenever they intend to take a vehicle off the road and keep it untaxed. A declaration has to be completed which advised DVLA that the vehicle is neither to be used nor kept on a public road. Doesn't look too good :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markzx Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 The fact that you have no Third party insurance is going to go against you. I had a transit van in a similar circumstance from my Band days. (About 20 years ago) I was find £600 and 6 points at the majistrates court. I appealed and deffended myself at Crown court. I argued that the vehical was off the road and made as safe as possible to the general public. I also explained that I was of work after a motorcycle accident and i therefore Had had neither funds or physical ability to carry out repares. That I had tried many friends and other avenues to try and get the vehical into a safe yard, but had failed. Therefore I had ensured that the vehicle was as safe as I could make it until I was fit to deal with it. I also said "Knowing that it is an offence to have no insurance or MOT on a Council addopted area or public highway, I can accept having my knucles wrapped, but in light of my circumstances I felt the fine and the points were excesive". I was hoping for maybe 3 points and a £150 fine. Instead they quashed the points and gave me a £25 fine and told me to get the vehical remove ASAP. To which I could inform them that I'd had it repared and sold it. You won't get off but you can limit the damage if your honest. Though I should imagine that the Magistrates court will hammer you and you'll need to appeal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viniboy Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 With a lot of solicitor firms you are allowed a (30 minute??) consultation for free. I did this a few years back and although the bloke wasnt the most helpful he did tell me my rights. I would make a few phone calls mate and see if you can get some advise? It seems that the car is still on part of a public highway but you are not required to have insurance/licence to own a vehicle just to drive it. you might have to suffer the Tax offence but the others are IMO arguable. HTH Vini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGSSS Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 Back now. Puffed out trying to move the car, the old heart can't take it lol. Where the car is parked used to be a grass verge but the council covered it with Tarmac in order for you to park off the road and let the traffic flow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markzx Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 Back now. Puffed out trying to move the car, the old heart can't take it lol. Where the car is parked used to be a grass verge but the council covered it with Tarmac in order for you to park off the road and let the traffic flow. That then is now addopted highway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 Is on a public highway still, even if on the pavement, as said above it doesn't class as being off road? If you have no tax i'm surprised they haven't just towed it. They towed my brother in laws car from the pavement outside his house as it had no tax, he wasn't given any warning they just towed it. Insurance is needed at least to cover third parties even if not being driven. Worth fighting to limit the damage as said above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGSSS Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 Its seems like it will turn out to be an expensive hobby lol. I should have thought about it a bit more but i didn't think i was doing anything ilegal, just pottering about with my car. I'm blaming my wife now as i had motor trade insurance up until a few months ago and she said it was a waste of money so i cancelled it. I'm not too worried about points on my license as i'm agoraphobic and don't go out much anyway, i've done 800 miles in my other car since its previous MOT until its presant MOT so its probably a waste of money when you think about the cost of Insurance and road tax. The only reason i bought the Z was to try and get me out more as up until a few months ago i would very rarly leave the house. Anyway i thought they might have just warned me and given me the chance to move it as it was just the beat Police and not the Traffic Police. I also thought they issued you with the pink slip thingy but i got nothing, they just said there piece and left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viniboy Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 I dont know if this will help but if you have a bit of spare time on your hands have a look at this site. http://www.ukinsurancedirectory.com/links/insurancelaw.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Coopers-SWB Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 An extract from north lanarkshire councils website about keeping roads clear from ice. Under Section 34 of the Roads (Scotland) Act, 1984, North Lanarkshire Council has a statutory obligation to take such steps as it considers reasonable to prevent snow and ice endangering the safe passage of pedestrians and vehicles over their public roads which by definition includes carriageways, footways and footpaths. I take this to mean that the paths are part of the road. Therefore any vehicle parked on it must have tax, MOT and insurance. Your best bet is to get in touch with a solicitor or the citizens advice to see where you stand. Darrell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGSSS Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 An extract from north lanarkshire councils website about keeping roads clear from ice. Under Section 34 of the Roads (Scotland) Act, 1984, North Lanarkshire Council has a statutory obligation to take such steps as it considers reasonable to prevent snow and ice endangering the safe passage of pedestrians and vehicles over their public roads which by definition includes carriageways, footways and footpaths. I take this to mean that the paths are part of the road. Therefore any vehicle parked on it must have tax, MOT and insurance. Your best bet is to get in touch with a solicitor or the citizens advice to see where you stand. Darrell Yes, i will see a solicitor and thanks for the advice. The law is the law but my brother in law who was just up helping me move the car said the police had stopped at his house because my 10 year old nephew was sitting on his motorbike which was on the path and advised that as soon as my nephew drove the bike from the path too the road they could charge him for riding on the public highway but he was fine if he stayed on the path. So where's the justice. The thing is i have a driveway but as its just 2 rows of slabs its not suitable for working under the car, thats the only reason it was parked where it was, its been a hard lesson learned lol. :headvswal As for North Lanarshire Council, my 7 year old daughter fell down a manhole cover just across the road in the pics, she wasn't seriously injured but she got a fright as the concrete had crumbled away and as she stepped on it the cover spun round and she fell in the hole, she couldn't climb out as it was too deep. Anyway when i reported this too the council they said they didn't know who belonged to the stretch of road so maybe i should park there lol. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaza Steve Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 the key words here are neither to be used nor kept on a public road they have to prove that it is kept on a public road Not parked temporarily .....you may have just moved it there temp this morning to do some repairs to it that could not be done where it was initially ..they will have to prove it has been Kept on the road ,,seek guidance from a solicitor what the legal meaning of Kept on a highway means .......in the meantime find where the copper lives go round to his house and kick him hard in the nuts if he has any that is .....wont do any good and will probably get you shed loads of bother .but it wont half make you feel better :)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Saz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Looks like its not on private land to me, therefore the law can be enforced, this is a relitively new ruling and in my opinion stinks, not everyone is lucky enough to have a driveway or big amount of land they can store a vehicle on when they are not running it. In my eyes this is just another way to ensure more people pay out into the already overloaded coffers, take note, it happened to a friend of mine, he had a highly modified saxo, looked a tit, but cost him in the tens of thousands, he got told to shift it, he did, it was seen on public land again and crushed!! What really annoys me is that whilst the police are wasting time with this crap, a car causing no harm to anyone, somewhere in your town, some yob will have been dealing drugs or stealing a car!! where is the sense in that? The police are no longer law enfoprcers but tax enforcers, quite sickening!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest deve8uk Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 guys a footpath is public highway. that aside, in lew that it has no engine or gearbox, is sorn. i think you have a good case to write to the police and say, do you realy want this to go to court and waste tax payers money. Better still get you lawyer to write to tehm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGSSS Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 in the meantime find where the copper lives go round to his house and kick him hard in the nuts if he has any that is .....wont do any good and will probably get you shed loads of bother .but it wont half make you feel better :)) Hi i don't think this would work as SHE was quite hard looking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie5 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Im damn sure they can only do you for no tax, you havent driven the car so cant do you for no insurance or mot and with an mot test that allows you to DRIVE it on the road same as insurance. Fight it mate there only trying to line there pockets! I have two cars parked on road with no tax no mot no insurance and I get a copper turn in my road often who does nothing even with one which im stripping and jacked up. Make the coppers life hard mate fight it all the way make them do as much paper work as poss.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edk83 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Thats what i thought to be honest. Sorn says has to be on private land, driveway or garage so your stuck with the no tax, but thats like 80 quid fine right? The only reason I can see that you need insurance is for public liability, ie someone failling over it etc You might get away with that on your home insurance policy tho? Mot - dont think the law says you need it for it to be parked on a road Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkysi Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Sorn says has to be on private land, driveway or garage so your stuck with the no tax, but thats like 80 quid fine right? Up to £1000 and/or they have the right to take the car away to be crushed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkysi Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Mot - dont think the law says you need it for it to be parked on a road Technically you do as the insurance is void. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Saz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 surely if you need to be taxed to be on the road and you need a mot to get taxed surely, that is an offence too not to have a test on the car? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edk83 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 but do you need insurance other than public liability? (if its not being driven of course) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Saz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 as long as you car has tax, irrelevant of insurance as far as im aware you can not done for not having insurance, is insurance just for when you are driving on public roads and not parked up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkysi Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 as long as you car has tax, irrelevant of insurance as far as im aware you can not done for not having insurance, is insurance just for when you are driving on public roads and not parked up? Pretty sure that's incorrect Saz. Any vehicle parked on public land must have insurance afaik as well as tax and MOT. If the car bursts into flames and distroyes someone else's property without it being driven then you're shafted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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