marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Was on my way home last nite at 9ish, just dropped my kids off in derbyshire. Off the A1 onto the A19, loads of spray/rain etc. Me, in my volvo, and another driver in new Saab estate. We were doing 70ish, hes in front, just as we come around a shallow bend i barely notice hazards flashing in the distance - as we get real close we realise someone has stopped in one of the 2 lanes on the A19 :headvswal :headvswal Unfortunately the Saab hit it at 70 ishmph and blew his car and parts all over the carraigeway - I swerved and smashed into the parts and it blew my front tyres out at 70mph, I finally managed to get the car to a halt 300 metres away from impact. The Saabs passenger wing, bonnet, wheel etc was embedded in to the passenger side of the car - a total right off. We went up to look at the other car. It was a fiesta. It was hit so hard it knocked it clean of the A19 and right up the inclines at the side. Inside it was an old lady :cry: It took 2 hrs to cut her out of the wreckage, the car was mashed. Apparently she just pulled over and stopped - no one knows why, but she was in a bad way when the ambulance carted her off. All the while bloody great trucks are thundering past with debris on the road that caused my blow out, when the cops arrived the traffic slowed down :xxx: She was fooking lucky a truck didnt hit her - she would not have made it. The worst thing about the whole accident was that where she stopped was a hump back bend......where I stopped (300 metres away) was a slip road :mad: Luckily the saab driver was ok, his car was totalled - he managed to get his off the road and parked near mine. I was totally caught off guard with the accident. I saw the hazards, so I kept looking at them.....all of a sudden when you are soooo close you realise they're not off the carraigeway......bang :( too late. I think I was very lucky last nite :( It may sound cruel but the old lady got the rewards for her stupidity. She could have easily got her car of the road, theres a verge right along the road large enought o drive on. I truly have no sympathy...she could have killed someone. If a truck would have clouted her, along with the volume of traffic - it would have been a real tradegy and ALL her fault :mad: That aside...I do hope she recovers.....and gets banned for being so careless. I finally get home at 11.30 after changing my tyres in the p*ss*ng rain for 2 1/2 hrs :headvswal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bantambunny Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Christ mate, i hope you get everything sorted soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lets drift Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Had she simply broken down as was unable to move the car any further? Also if it was so wet would she have been able to get her car onto a grass verge. If you see hazzard warning lights isn't it best practice to slow down especially if visiability is so bad, untill you've established quite what the hazzard is? Particularly as you couldn't tell if she was on the carriage way or not? Glad to hear you where able to get out okay. Must have been pretty nasty, experience for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 If she has started to slow down there was plenty of room to get the car off the road. But she broke the cardinal rule when you break down like that....she stayed in the car!!! I dont really care if it was an old bint or a young lad.....she could have killed someone because she REFUSED to think :headvswal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 Im perfectly OK. I was shaken at the speed of the blowout...not nice at 70 :rolleyes: But I heard the tyre go bang then it went slippery at the front, I just took my foot off the gas and kept away from the brake until the speed was lowish. My main concern was getting to the left side of the road cos trucks were hurtling past a few mins later - didnt want one of those up my pipe :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbow ZTT Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Not a good way to end the day, I think some people when they get really old are not safe on the roads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FASTREDZ Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 you were lucky there bud, glad everyone is alright!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lets drift Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Sorry but I've no sympathy for you what so ever the woman was warning traffice she had a problem you both under those conditions should have slowed down. The woman may only have just stopped and had not been able to get out of her car, have you not thought that had you both slowed down you both might have avoid the woman. If really pisses me off when someone has problems and pull over, puts on their hazards in an attempt to let other's know. And then you get other motorists completely ignoring them and blaming them cos they've not bothered to think 'oh wait a bit hazzard warning lights, dark wet road maybe I should reduce my speed as someone ahead is having trouble.' What if that was a pregant woman or a disabled driver or a family with kids in a car having trouble and they were trying to find a brake in the traffic to get out of their car. We need to think hazzard warning light come on guys that means some kind of hazzard/danger ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 Bud, we came around the bend and she was there....bang. There was no escape and the speed was not excessive. If you were in my car last night you would have seen the lights then 1..2.. bang thats all the time we had. If her car was slowing down she could have just driven off the tarmac, thats what its there for. She just didnt think. Im sure if it was a young chav we'd all be singing a diff song :rolleyes: But as it happens it wasnt.....because shes was an older lady it doesnt change my point of view. It would have been so easy to have got the car off the road if it was moving....even a little bit. In an ideal world with str8 roads and clear skies and 10kw headlights we would have missed her. But we had about 2 secs, I think I would have missed her but the saab driver said that the minute he knew she was in his lane he decided to move right a bit...not yank the wheel and swerve into the central reservation and possibly oncoming traffic. In doing so his front quarter hit her, lucky he did move because he effectively clipped her qtr to qtr. If he hadnt moved a bit he would have whacked it rite up the @rse and god knows what the effects of that would have been. Unfortunately I drive with a sense of possible wariness on the road (being a biker and all) so I half expect problems but I dont drive as if theres a person behind every car waiting to jump out. There are some situations in which you find your self at the mercy of the circumstances - last night was one of those. Had she been off the raod by even a bit we would have missed - but the silly cow was stopped right in the lane, not even to one side. Surley some degree of common sense dictates that when your on a major road and your car has to stop - you at least try to pull over, even if you cant get off the road!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest andyduff Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Far too many old folks on the road that shouldn't be. See it all the time, pulling out in front of people at roundabouts, out of junctions, nearly running people over at pedestrian crossings.... Its always them driving at 30mph on national speed limit roads. They simply cause accidents because they are no longer confident to drive at appropriate speeds, or don't have much common sense anymore and don't realise the chaos they're causing. Marc I'm 100% with you on this one bud and really glad everyone came out of it alive ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbow ZTT Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 When you get to a certain age you should be tested to make sure you are safe behind the wheel of a car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest andyduff Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 You do get retested but I think its at 70 or something then every 5 years after? Just ban the bloody coffin dodging oxygen thieves and banish them to the bus so they can all have a good sniff of each others collostemy bags :rofl: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbow ZTT Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Well the test must be ‘Can you still drive?’ ‘Yes’ ‘Well off you go then’ :rofl: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 Ive seen some appaling driving in my time. Ive done aound 300,000 miles since i passed my test and i never had a prang. But ive seen a hell of a lot of dithering ol twazzers trying to work out how there horseless carraiges go forwards :headvswal Some mindless ol gadgies drive completely oblivious to other drivers. They think that cos they're slow n dithering all over the place that they're safe...... :headvswal b*ll*x. I think some of them may even think that the slower you go the safer you are. So they probably deduce that if you actually grind to a halt you become immortal :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrawni Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 I'm glad nobody was killed and you are ok bud but, I have to agree with Lets drift. If its pissin down with rain and dark why the hell were you traveling at over the speed limit in the first place, what if that was a dear the saab driver hit with no lights to warn people about. Think about the trucks "Thundering past" they are limited to 56. If it was dry and clear both of you would have missed her, she may not have been able to clear the road or she may have been able, who knows some people do make bad decisions but you as a driver should be driving at a speed where you can see and take appropiate measurs to avoid danger. Anyway please don't think its a personal attack as I am glad you are ok, but just think if the old bird had have snuffed it the Saab driver could get done for death by dangerous driving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 Scrawni, I dont think the speed was excessive. The spot where the woman ended up was probably not one of the safest places around that area to grind to a halt, she had her reasons Im sure. She was just the other side of a small brow in the road and it was a slight right hooker. I dont think anyone in there right mind would have thought that there would have been a car sat right in the road. Even to cops said it was an awful place to stop. Yes as a retrospective armchair driver I should have been doing 30 in a 70...just in case something happens :rolleyes: But I dont know anyone who drives like that. We all drive with due care an attention but sometimes when someone pulls out in front of you or a kid runs out from behind a car etc etc you just have to react the best you can. I understand the concern for the woman BUT like I said ...if it was a chave we'd be saying something else. In my mind it doesnt make any difference. To have a driving license means that you are capable of controlling the vehicle in which you have the license, this means that you can operate it safely etc etc....to me this also means that your SENSIBLE enough to NOT make your vehicle an accident waiting to happen......which is exactly what she did. Like I said the cops were dumfounded as to why she stopped where she did when there was so much room to get off the road. Im also aware that obviously if she did have a problem then she may have been scared etc, i mean shes an old lady in the middle of nowhere (almost) and no one quite knows why she stopped, for all we know she could have taken the A19 turn by mistake and realising this stopped....it has been known. Im not trying to discredit her, im just pointing out that this accident could poss have been avoided....on her part. I was there and I had a few seconds to react to all the mayhem in front of me. I personally think the saab driver had nowhere to go without doing a serious right swerve....right across the carraigeway....not a good idea. The way I see it is exactly what I said to the saab driver..... Im glad it was him that hit her because there is no doubt in my mind sooner or later it would have been a truck and she could have been killed. Considering that the trucks tend to stay together on the motorways etc and the cars try and get around them - there would have been no room for anyone. I suppose I was slightly prepared for a problem because i started to move slightly to my right when I saw the hazard lights, but I still only had about 2 seconds before I realised her car was right in the road and then the saab hit her and I had managed to hit the debris and not either car. Maybe I would have missed her I dont know, all I know is i moved right and then instantly bang...they collide...then bang my tyres are gone...but I think i was clear and to the right of the original path of the vehicles. ....and yes in the mayham I cant remember much in detail about the impact i was focused on not loosing control myself. I couldnt even offer a decent statement straight afterwards. I never realised how the brain manages to lock out the surroundings and focus on the immidiacy of the job at hand. I got out of this with minimal damage but I do hope both other parties make a speedy recovery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 The roads are fast becoming dangerous places - wether it's through stupidity, negligence, volume of traffic or absolutely nobodies fault whatsoever etc etc....accidents are going to happen out there. The best we can do is err on the side of caution.....I know Im gonna be especially cautious of dips /rises on the roads....you just dont know whats around the corner... You just DONT know, no matter how good a driver/car you are/have. I certainly dont want to be involved in anything like that again. Be safe peeps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest andyduff Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Trouble is you slow down to take account of the conditions, then someone else who hasn't comes round the blind bend and slams right up your back end... If only the world was perfect.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Saz Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 you got to drive for everyone else on the road these days, im assuming all the people who are stepping in to accuse the old dear of causing an accident have indeed never done anything stupid, risky or dangerous in their time as a motorist? bet they have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Marc, i have to agree with you on the majority of somepoints you made and disagree with some. Firstly as most of you know im a serving police officer, and dealing with major accidents is something i do on a daily basis, so im probably talking from the most experienced point of view. With regards to the driver of the fiesta, your right there is no reason why she couldnt have made it to the hard shoulder. On a national speed limit road, she would have been able to coast to the hard shoulder. The only possible "reasonable" explanation for being in lane 2 is that she herself had been involved in a collision herself resulting in her car being disabled in lane 2. As this hasnt been previously mentioned im going to guess there is no evidence to support this explanation. If she had simpley broken down there is NO reason why she could not have coasted to the hard shoulder,and the likelyhood the investigating officer will take this point of view as well i would suggest is very strong. I would probably suggest the fact she was parked in lane 2, regardless of hazard lights being on, is the major contributor to the cause of the collision. With regard to the Saab driver, i think better observation was required, even coming round a slight corner on a brow of a hill, i cant see any reason why at a substantial distance he wasnt able to establish that there was a car broken down in his lane, or at least suspect that there was a car in the carridgeway. I think the above point carrys over to marc. Personally if i saw a car with hazards on in the distance and im not 100% sure its on the hard shoulder, i would adjust my speed accordingly. BUT im and trained advanced police driver, so i probably drive alot differently to alot of you. The part i disagree with the most is the "there was nothing i could do". Now think logically about this, there was plenty that you could do. The basis of roadcraft is that you drive on the information you recieve and act accordingly. Dont get me wrong mate im not trying to put you down or criticise your driving or anything like that, im just trying to bring another angle to the conversation and give an insight to what the police will be thinking. im glad your ok and so is everyone, and at the end of the day i wasnt there and neither was anyone else on here, so im only commenting on the info i have, but only you and everyone else who was involved know what happened. Anyway all the best mate and if their is anything you want to ask me feel free nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lets drift Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Is the A19 a dualcarriage way as then it would only have 2 lanes and no hard shoulder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickz32 Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Is the A19 a dualcarriage way as then it would only have 2 lanes and no hard shoulder. then it will have a grass verge at the very least, with enough room to get a vehicle out of the carrigeway enough so it doesnt cause an obstruction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lets drift Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 then it will have a grass verge at the very least, with enough room to get a vehicle out of the carrigeway enough so it doesnt cause an obstruction Hopefully it will although I know a number of dual carrieways with only the tinest of verges with soft verge signs on them and with pretty deep ditches droping down the side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGSSS Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 I have been watching this thread build and i have to say i agree with Nick. The fact that you have stated you saw the hazards in the distance but failed to slow down, you also admit you were speeding in adverse weather conditions (we've all done this) if you saw the hazards in the distance and being in the second car would state that the Saab driver had a better view so why did he not slow down, this would then have caused you to adjust your speed also, then the fact that you couldn't avoid the debry would indicate your stopping diststance between you and the Saab was too close. I've been in this situation but i was the one who was stationary, my car had spun on oil on a bend, the car had spun several times took off over a grass verge still spinning and came to a halt in the fast lane of the M8 facing the wrong way during rush hour. My car had no damage at first but as i sat wondering how to get the car facing the right way a car hit me and spun me round. I drove over to the hard shoulder but the girl who hit me had to have her car towed of the motorway, i was cringing at the metal being dragged along the ground. (She only picked the car up the day before) I even told everyone at the scene that it was my fault but it turned out it wasn't. The lawyers dealing for the insurance company stated that as 2 cars had moved to avoid me then the third car could have avoided me also and that she was either going too fast too allow for a safe stopping distance. I really do feel sorry for marcz32 but i would not have posted this stating all my mistakes as Nick might not be the only police officer viewing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest deve8uk Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 First, great your OK Sory mark. I agree that she should not of stopped in teh lane, maybe there was a reason for it, car disabled. Anyway I am sure teh police will sort that out. But I dont see eye to eye with you other comments. Speed, distance, conditions. Sory mate, dont add up. If you see hazards you are suposed to slow down, failing to do so leads to? If you had limited visability and you where doing 70+ then your lucky youo got away with a wrote off car. But I am sure you are going to asked these questions by the police and the insurance companies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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