what a piss poor pile of absolute shit

 

creche is closed, go home to your parents

 

everyone come see me at billing, i'll fight all of you blindfolded with my hands tied to my feet and my car parked up my arse

 

you cant miss me, i'm the short skinny bloke who tries to be friendly, help everyone out and provide a service that should be useful

 

many many thanks to all the people that want to see the forum live on under its own steam (i can count you all on my own digits and other appendages....) but i'm sorry to say that i am considering sending all the money back to you

 

either that, or i make this a completely private forum for the aforementioned people that have shown support, and we become one of the smallest internet cliques in existence

 

it is a shame that two of the biggest and funniest characters on here dont get along, but thats life

 

i wont try to calm things down, as i get accused of taking sides, but i dont give a stuff who is right and who is wrong

 

everyone please just keep posting all the crap, start more and more arguments, and drive all the other owners away, we dont need most of the members...

 

how do we even know they exist, they never post anything, can't understand for the life of me why not....

 

i mean after all, isnt everyone a bad mouthed, short tempered, overly aggressive, narrow minded conman, just out to rip friends and family off ?

 

i am sure that was the criteria to join this flea infested pit of boy racers

 

enjoy the forum for as long as it takes for my ex employer to find my server in their datacenter, cos i'm not sure i even want to bother anymore, and i'm damn sure they'll turn it off when they do find it

Who exactly has been saying they can do a better job than Craig and Nico?

 

Are you seriously telling me that this site needs more than 20-30GB of transfer per month?

 

It can't be costing that much or this server would have been pulled from it's hiding place a long time ago. Cost and what people usually pay for it are two very different things.

 

At the moment I wouldn't really give a toss if the site goes down because it's turned into a big pile of shite.

I don't enjoy reading people slagging each other off and generally being offensive to anybody and everybody.

 

just make a new room to go in, bitchin corner or sumthing!

I dont know, I take my eye off you guys for a moment and you start talking about closing things down.

 

Craig, you own the BBS, you run the BBS so you run it how you want. If you see posts that you dont like edit them or remove them, if you see somebody you dont like put them on moderation if thats an option. You cant please all the people all the time. I have seen people come and people go on the mkivsupra.net BBS. Some were pushed, others jumped but I would not let two people slag each other off so much it takes everything else down around them, and I certainly wont let it get me down. To really resolve it you will need to take sides, some people just clash and will never get on.

 

When I used to run the Supra mail list I told people 'if they dont like the way I run things they should fk off and start their own club'. You need to be brutal to stop things getting out of hand. And if anybody tries that 'free speech' crap then tell them to start their own BBS and have all the free speech they want.

 

I also personally wouldnt use PayPal (who have just been bought by E-bay btw), as its set up for US people, you get whacked a percentage for using it, then get whacked for converting to pounds sterling and the person paying gets whacked as well. Use direct money transfer or cheques.

 

So there you go, thats my view point done....

 

JB

www.mkivsupra.net (taking no shit since 2001)

 

 

[This message has been edited by Branners (edited 12-07-2002).]

nice one, Branners

good advice banners,ive only ever had to bite back once and that was more than i would like .

were all adults here and should no better!

Well well well, he said in the style of the big bloke in Mad Max when he was trying to persuade Max to stay a cop.

 

I have just re-read this thread from start to end again and to me it should stay sticky forever if Craig can be arsed to take this place forward.

 

I myself have posted some purile shite on here, really purile in hindsight, but not nasty or vindictive stuff, just purile (and with bad punctuation)

 

The only advice I have offered is my own thoughts, and my own thoughts are that I would have pulled the plug long ago - thank the lord zed that this place isnt under my control I guess... Craig seems to me to have the patience of some sort of Saint, that and his loyalty to the people here - good and indifferent.

 

But here are the facts - 300zx.co.uk is running on a beat up old Pentium stuck in some broom cupboard.

 

Now that beat up old box could probably be made to soldier on for a while or next time it goes and blows a jpeg out its ass, maybe Craig says 'fuck-it' and 300zx.co.uk is no more... whatcha reckon, would you like to lay odds? maybe 12/1-on its turned off permenantly? maybe evens its patched up? I dunno Im specualting - I am a betting man and I know which way I would be punting!

 

Shall we pay for this or should it be free?

What do YOU think?

If you think it runs on thin air then say so, voice your opinion.

I dont care a toss if you are contributing or gonna contribute or thinking about contributing or just not gonna dontate.

 

I do know that I am pricing the whole thing up from a hardware point of view, and shit I am gonna chuck stuff in for free...thats all i can do.

 

To all the software guys who offered help then Nice One!

To all the Hardware guys who offered help the Nice One!

To all the Bandwidth guys who offered help then Nice One!

To all the friends of 300zx.co.uk who offered help then Nice One!

To all those who make this place what it is then Nice One!

To all those that seek to fuck it up, well, not so Nice One!

 

Peace.

 

Glen

 

Criag and Nico, and indeed all the serious members on here, my sympathies for this situation. As co-admin at aus300zx.com I know how frustrating it can be when you're putting a lot of time and effort into something that seems to get very little support from the members (shot at any aus300zx.com guys reading this: give me some damn FAQ info! ).

 

When working well a forum can be a place that saves people literally thousands of dollars (well, pounds ), provides the odd chuckle and can be the foundation for very long friendships. When working poorly, it can be frustrating, insulting and not worth the effort. Sorry it has come to that.

 

If interested, email me and I can give some info on the host that we use for aus300zx.com, it is quite cheap (around 30 pounds a year), has unlimited space (we're at around 300Mb without any complaint) and the bandwidth is ok.... good enough for a forum anyway. Add domain name registration into the equation and all up it works out to being abour 50 pounds a year to run. We raised this money by selling stickers.

 

Anyway, I know you weren't after ideas on how to solve the situation, I just wanted to say good luck, hope a solution can be found, and I know what the administrators and members who really love this site are going through.

 

Ben

blipman@yoyo.its.monash.edu.au

 

 

Originally posted by dino:

For those in IT who think that it's easy to host a good quality site, you're talking rubbish, because you don't understand the dilemma of hosting and bandwidth requirements.

 

It's very easy to host a good quality site. It's just hard to find a good quality hosting company. I know of a absolutely superb one.

 

Hands up those that have hosted a professional site themselves! Thought so, otherwise you'd see that 20-30Gb of transfer per month is peanuts.

 

20-30GB is a very large amount for a car-based club. It's anything *but* peanuts.

 

Does anyone have any idea how much bandwidth charges cost above the allocated data transfer rate? It could end up costing a fortune. Who would pay for THAT?

 

It does, but not as much as your making out. Besides, that's what the members money is for - to pay that. It's perfectly possible for an internet club to be self-supporting.

 

Right, on to people who think they can do a better job. Where's your evidence? Can you prove that you'd be committed to making sure that the service is always "UP" and that it's well moderated and not digging a big "legal" hole? How do you feel about stepping on the founders' toes?

 

My evidence: http://www.sxoc.com/vbb

 

Sorry, I had to say this, because I've not read such a big load of CRAP on a single thread in my life!

 

Yup - but a large part of it was in your own post.

 

You're in a situation where your forum could go down and you sit there taking chunks out of each other.

 

Truthfully? You don't deserve to have your own forum!

 

Now that's helpful - you complain about people doing nothing to help the situation - but then do nothing to help the situation!

 

This is what helping the situation looks like:

 

Craig/Nico - I am willing to discuss moving the 300ZX board over to the 200SX server. However, there will be some requirements:

 

1: 300ZX BB users pay for the bandwidth the site uses. If there is less money coming in than the board costs, we'll trim back the service, or stop it completely.

 

2: It's moderated to SXOC standards, *by* SXOC moderators. This will eliminate a large portion of the crap, dross and shit that keeps people from going to this site, plus reduce bandwidth costs. It might actually attract more users, and cause the club to grow, just like ours has. Craig and Nico will obviously remain site admins, but we'll just add our resources to the day-to-day running.

Dino, before you go and slag off my offer get your facts correct.

 

I run a hosting company currently hosting some of the major players in the hosting and media industry. 30 gig is peanuts when you are pushing perhaps 3000gig a month.

 

Estimates of the traffic of 300zx.co.uk are around the 5gig mark I would hazard a guess at.

 

Now you obviously have never done any bandwidth sums. I am offering 20gig a month gratis with an aditional charge of £3 a gig over that traffic that is as near to cost as I can go without making the books look a mess.

 

99% network uptime. As for legal issues, a lot of people go over the top with these, it would take a lot of time and money to drag anything through the courts that is posted on a public board. It has been done but its not worth it. All nick and craig have to do is pass judgement when they are servered a letter by a lawyer. The host will never be in trouble over libel/slander.

 

Everyone is turning this into a big drama, trust me ive seen communities in worse states like this and its people like you dino who come in and just try to stir up shit that make it worse.

 

The major thing is getting the hardware in place, that is your major initial cost. Once thats in place its simple.

 

Mike

 

Sorry guys, I am going to be as guilty as the rest of us - instead of biting my tongue.

 

The cost of the forum and the pros / cons of various solutions were never the reason for this thread.

 

The point at issue was how vitriolic and poisonous this forum gets at the drop of a hat.

 

So why arguments start on a thread from the admin guy complaining about arguments is beyond me.

 

If people want administrators and participants to get p*ssed off with continual sniping, then just carry on.

 

Amongst those of us who have offered hardware, hosting and bandwidth I am sure we can come up with (if we haven't already) a solution which Craig / Nico would find good.

 

But that isn't the point of this thread - (if anyone wants to carry on talking about forum solutions privately, e-mail me. Talking about it in public just starts flames which I don't care about.) - the point was how nasty, petty arguments start which make this forum look like the least pleasant place on earth to be.

 

Can we please keep the flames private and the forum nice? Or at least, nicer?

.

 

[This message has been edited by dino (edited 16-07-2002).]

OK, this one's for the Mo Fos having a pop at ME. What about YOU that are trying to step on Craig and Nico's toes? Are they cunts for keeping this thing going for all this time, for you to come in and say "oh yeah, I'll host it and moderate it, etc, etc!"

 

You're fucking leeches! I feel sorry for the serious ZX owners that want to genuinely know more about their car...

 

I'm unaffected either way, but I just sympathise with Craig and Nico for wasting their time on saps like you...

 

Regards,

Dino

 

Man: Good morning, I'd like to have an argument, please.

Receptionist: Certainly, sir. Have you been here before?

Man: No, this is my first time.

Receptionist: I see, well we'll see who's free at the moment. Mr. Bakely's free, but he's a little bit concilliatory. No. Try Mr. Barnhart, room 12.

Man: Thank you.

 

He enters room 12.

Angry man: WHADDAYOU WANT?

Man: Well, Well, I was told outside that...

Angry man: DON'T GIVE ME THAT, YOU SNOTTY-FACED HEAP OF PARROT DROPPINGS!

Man: What?

Angry man: SHUT YOUR FESTERING GOB, YOU TIT! YOUR TYPE MAKES ME PUKE! YOU VACUOUS

STUFFY-NOSED MALODOROUS PERVERT!!!

Man: Yes, but I came here for an argument!!

Angry man: OH! Oh! I'm sorry! This is abuse!

Man: Oh! Oh I see!

Angry man: Aha! No, you want room 12A, next door.

Man: Oh...Sorry...

Angry man: Not at all!

Angry man: (under his breath) stupid git.

The man goes into room 12A. Another man is sitting behind a desk.

Man: Is this the right room for an argument?

Other Man pause) I've told you once.

Man: No you haven't!

Other Man: Yes I have.

Man: When?

Other Man: Just now.

Man: No you didn't!

Other Man: Yes I did!

Man: You didn't!

Other Man: I did!

Man: You didn't!

Other Man: I'm telling you, I did!

Man: You didn't!

Other Man: (breaking into the developing argument) Oh I'm sorry, is this a five minute argument, or the full half hour?

Man: Ah! (taking out his wallet and paying) Just the five minutes.

Other Man: Just the five minutes. Thank you. Anyway, I did.

Man: You most certainly did not!

Other Man: Now let's get one thing perfectly clear: I most definitely told you!

Man: Oh no you didn't!

Other Man: Oh yes I did! ___

Man: Oh no you didn't! ›

Other Man: Oh yes I did! ›

Man: Oh no you didn't! ›

Other Man: Oh yes I did! ›

Man: Oh no you didn't! ›

Other Man: Oh yes I did! ›

Man: Oh no you didn't! ›

Other Man: Oh yes I did! > very fast

Man: Oh no you didn't! /

Other Man: Oh yes I did! /

Man: No you DIDN'T! /

Other Man: Oh yes I did! /

Man: No you DIDN'T! /

Other Man: Oh yes I did! /

Man: No you DIDN'T! /

Other Man: Oh yes I did! ___/

Man: Oh look, this isn't an argument!

(pause)

Other Man: Yes it is!

Man: No it isn't!

(pause)

Man: It's just contradiction!

Other Man: No it isn't!

Man: It IS!

Other Man: It is NOT!

Man: You just contradicted me!

Other Man: No I didn't!

Man: You DID!

Other Man: No no no!

Man: You did just then!

Other Man: Nonsense!

Man: (exasperated) Oh, this is futile!!

(pause)

Other Man: No it isn't!

Man: Yes it is!

(pause)

I came here for a good argument!

Other Man: AH, no you didn't, you came here for an *argument*!

Man: An argument isn't just contradiction.

Other Man: Well! it CAN be!

Man: No it can't! An argument is a connected series of statement intended to establish a proposition.

Other Man: No it isn't!

Man: Yes it is! 'tisn't just contradiction.

Other Man: Look, if I *argue* with you, I must take up a contrary position!

Man: Yes but it isn't just saying "no it isn't".

Other Man: Yes it is!

Man: No it isn't!

Other Man: Yes it is!

Man: No it isn't!

Other Man: Yes it is!

Man: No it ISN'T! Argument is an intellectual process. Contradiction is just the automatic gainsaying of anything the other person says.

Other Man: It is NOT!

Man: It is!

Other Man: Not at all!

Man: It is!

>DING!

Other Man: Thank you, that's it.

Man: (stunned) What?

Other Man: That's it. Good morning.

Man: But I was just getting interested!

Other Man: I'm sorry, the five minutes is up.

Man: That was never five minutes!!

Other Man: I'm afraid it was.

Man: (leading on) No it wasn't.....

(pause)

Other Man: (dirty look) I'm sorry, I'm not allowed to argue any more.

Man: WHAT??

Other Man: If you want me to go on arguing, you'll have to pay for another five minutes.

Man: But that was never five minutes just now!

(pause... the Other Man raises his eyebrows)

Oh Come on! Oh this is... This is ridiculous!

Other Man: I told you... I told you, I'm not allowed to argue unless you PAY!

Man: Oh all right. (takes out his wallet and pays again.) There you are.

Other Man: Thank you.

Man: (clears throat) Well...

Other Man: Well WHAT?

Man: That was never five minutes just now.

Other Man: I told you, I'm not allowed to argue unless you've paid!

Man: Well I just paid!

Other Man: No you didn't!

Man: I DID!!!

Other Man: YOU didn't!

Man: I DID!!!

Other Man: YOU didn't!

Man: I DID!!!

Other Man: YOU didn't!

Man: I DID!!!

Other Man: YOU didn't!

Man: (unable to talk straight he's so mad) I don't want to argue about it!

Other Man: Well I'm very sorry but you didn't pay!

Man: Ah HAH!! Well if I didn't pay, why are you arguing??? Ah HAAAAAAHHH! Gotcha!

Other Man: (pause) No you haven't!

Man: Yes I have! If you're arguing, I must have paid.

Other Man: Not necessarily. I *could* be arguing in my spare time.

 

 

LOL!

 

Senna, you've just described, in a roundabout way, what the 300ZX forum has become. People coming in and wanting to argue to kill time.

 

In the process of demonstrating your point, though, you've added about 8k's worth of content that needs to be transferred every time you access this thread. Then there's the fancy sigs that everyone uses. How much bandwidth do THEY use?

 

Anyway, enough of the hosting argument. I'd just like to remind people on this forum of the stress and hassle that Craig and Nico have had to go through for the "smooth" running of this site. I won't mention company names, but quite often, a discussion will spawn about the bad practices of Company X, and how they rip people off, etc, etc. Who do you think has had to deal with the threats of legal action on grounds of libel for messages posted by forum members? Who do you think has got leaned on to give them IP addresses, emails, vital statistics, you name it?

 

Do I need to remind people of what Craig and Nico have gone through on behalf of their fellow members?

 

Give them support and encouragement, and show some understanding of what they have to do as administrators, and you might still have a forum to fight on.

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by dino (edited 16-07-2002).]

Originally posted by dino:

OK, this one's for the Mo Fos having a pop at ME. What about YOU that are trying to step on Craig and Nico's toes? Are they cunts for keeping this thing going for all this time, for you to come in and say "oh yeah, I'll host it and moderate it, etc, etc!"

 

You're fucking leeches! I feel sorry for the serious ZX owners that want to genuinely know more about their car...

 

I'm unaffected either way, but I just sympathise with Craig and Nico for wasting their time on saps like you...

 

Regards,

Dino

 

Not sure if you realize this Dino but the 200sx club used to be kindly hosted by Craig on the 300zx server before it became a club and raised money to find it's own home.

I think it was more of a offer of help than trying to 'leech'.

 

Not gonna get in an argument with you for the sake of the thread.

 

 

An offer to host a site and leave control to the original owner is one thing, to offer to moderate it too is stepping on someone's toes in my eyes.

 

 

Originally posted by dino:

OK, this one's for the Mo Fos having a pop at ME. What about YOU that are trying to step on Craig and Nico's toes? Are they cunts for keeping this thing going for all this time, for you to come in and say "oh yeah, I'll host it and moderate it, etc, etc!"

 

 

This was not your original argument, your original argument insinuated that people offering to help didn't know what they are doing. You were proven wrong so don't try and argue it.

 

Mike

Originally posted by dino:

An offer to host a site and leave control to the original owner is one thing, to offer to moderate it too is stepping on someone's toes in my eyes.

 

 

This looks to me like an offer to help and take a lot of the hastle out of running the board.

As all that was offered is that their moderators would be moderating and Craig and Nico would be the Administrators, how does that change anything from the way it's run now? There are already other moderators.

 

It's not your toes that would be stepped on anyway so why is your opinion relevant?

 

Fine - offer duly retracted.

MikeGroves, if you can be bothered to scroll a few inches up the page, you'll see that, not only did I cover my gripes about the issue of people underestimate the complexity of hosting, but I also stated my frustrations with regards to people muscleing in on someone else's show. I don't see where I was proven wrong because you don't know the bandwidth comsumption of this forum. And as for calculations, mate, where did you dream YOUR figures up from? Based on what assumptions? There's no way you'd know unless you were an administrator. So where's the proof that I'm "wrong"? If you're running a hosting company that's averaging 3000Gig per month across several customers, then you couldn't even comprehend the volume of traffic that I've seen on ONE SINGLE site that I managed so don't tell me I don't know how to make basic bandwidth calculations. Since you can't be bothered to scroll, I'll state what I said before AGAIN!

 

"Does anyone have any idea how much bandwidth charges cost above the allocated data transfer rate? It could end up costing a fortune. Who would pay for THAT?"

 

Now I'll translate for ya. you say you'd give 20Gb transfer. So what exactly would you charge £3 for? Let me guess, per 100Mb more? Right, so if the site got another 5Gb traffic, you'd want another £150 more, JUST for that month????

 

Here's the calc 5Gb= 5000MB= 50 x 100Mb = 50x£3 = £150.

 

What if a particular month was HIGHER? Who would pay for THAT? Don't think we're all mugs here!

 

I seem to remember big video files being available on this site. You think this don't take up bandwidth? Yeah, sure, you could create forum with no sigs or images and other media types to cut down bandwidth consumption to a mininum, but if you want a good forum and site where you can do loads of things with it, you're gonna have to fork out for bandwidth.

 

Chris C, you may not be stepping on MY toes, but you'd be stepping on my friend's. I'm just saying what others should be saying.

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by dino (edited 17-07-2002).]

Originally posted by Keith_C:

Fine - offer duly retracted.

 

And why's that? Because I'M having a go at you? If you wanted the forum to stay, you wouldn't be so easily distracted by what I said, but more interested in what the administrators had to say.

 

For your reference, I didn't think either good or bad about your initial offer, but when you attacked MY post as containing most of the crap, you started a snowball rolling.

 

Put up or shut up...

 

LMAO @ glens post, ive never laughed so much in ages!

 

------------------

WHOA!

 

Just cool it a moment guys.

 

Take a little time to think over what it is being said here.

 

Fighting/bitching in this manner just makes the whole thing worse, bite your lip and think.

 

ALL sites need some moderation, and although I think Mr. Churchill is a prick, he has made a generous offer, if he could be persuaded remove the 'rider' about being moderated to SXOC standards then it should be taken up.

 

On the LSOC we have only a small amount of moderation, no 'swear filter' (even when it was 'open') and only one person has ever been banned, moderation can and should be just that MODERATE.

 

This forum takes on all comers and you fight your corner, that is good.

 

I suggest you make the 2 most vocal and immoderate people here (whoever they are) the 'moderators' things would change here very rapidly and I think I can guarantee for the better. If possible there 'Sphere of influence' should be just the 'General Forum' bit in the beginning and when they have 'settled down' they can have the rest to deal with.

 

Simply because after they had 'moderated' each other viciously (I'd encourage that) the 'novelty' would wear off and calmer more social atmosphere would return.

 

Have a pop if you like but it is only a suggestion.

 

To quote from something I posted just before being banned from the Supra site;

 

'As Woody said in 'Toy Story' (a fine example for any grown man to follow, I think you'll agree) "PLAY NICE"

 

 

Dino,

You are getting very upset about a forum that you had only written 2 posts on.

You are obviously someone we know better under another name. Which one of the 2 usual moaners are you? As you so politely said... Put up or shut up!

 

Have you read this post? http://www.300zx.co.uk/forums/ubbforum/Forum1/HTML/008398.html

 

Thanks for all the calculations but if you read Mike's offer above properly you will see he offered 20GB per month FREE plus £3 PER GB over that amount. So if it goes over by your 5GB example then that works out to me to be £15 not £150. Seems like a very good deal to me but maybe others can beat it?

I'd be suprised if they offer after all this to be honest. I offered a a few hundred quids wirth of Qube server which is similar to the Raq units this site will probably be hosted on. What have you offered apart from your usual rantings and abuse?

 

"I'm just saying what others should be saying."

Are you really? Why aren't they saying it then? I'm sure they will if thats what they want to do.

 

Seems to me like you don't dare show your face, you can't read and think everyone else should think the same as you...

 

It would sum it up nicely if Dino was really Craig -

cue spooky music and psychotic laughter

---mwwoohhoooohahhhaaaa---

 

In the daytime mildmannered Craig, in the evening psycho 'BANDWIDTH MAN' -

He fights for justice

He spouts about Gigabytes

He Corrects injustices

He wears womens underwear!

 

He's 'BANDWIDTH MAN'

 

F*** with him at your peril - He's 'BANDWIDTH MAN' - the man who knows more about 300zx.co.uk in 8 posts than all of us put together!!

 

This is like an episode of Spooks without the good acting.

 

Go BANDWIDTH MAN man

 

Hehehe

 

Nutters!

 

 

 

------------------

->Glen