Speaking on behalf of ALL Traders YES EVEN SE !! When you guys have finished bitching about who is shite and giving some companys a unjustified reputation, Who are you going to have to work on your cars ? Whispers in the trade tell us that several retail outlets are getting pissed off with some people especialy when the incidence that are refered have never been refered back the the person or company concerned. Never mind not telling the full story about what has actuallt happened. The forum is slowly getting a tarnished image in some areas which is a great pity because it is, when used in the correct manner, an excellent forum. One word to remind yourselves all off before you go blowing your horns again LIBEL !! Think about it guys....lets not ruin the image of a truly awesome car.

 

Yours

 

The Traders voice

 

Simple answer to LIBEL, put the words 'Without Prejudice' on top of every post you make, sometimes being a Lawyer has its destinct advantages.

 

;-)

 

Without Prejudice

 

Why do you refer to SE sperateley to ALL Traders? They are no different to anyone else who carries out work on our cars.

 

Generally, no trader should have comments made about them in the 'bad experience forum' unless there is good reason for it.

 

Recommendations work both ways and therefore they have advantages and dis-advantages.

 

If your a trader reading this who's knows you always do a good job then there's no need to be concerned that your'll end up being mentioned in the wrong forum.

 

Without prejudice :-)

 

What do these traders plan to do? Are they going to refuse to take our money?

 

The labour rate and parts prices for 300ZXs tend to be higher than average and the work tends to be complicated. That combination leads to some very large bills. Is it unreasonable to expect work to be done properly when you pay a lot for it?

 

Surely the decent traders will only benefit from all the recommendations on here.

 

 

hhmmmmmm wonder who posted the top thread (lol)

i guess if you traders are so upset about it, why dont you do something about it, i challenge you to do your "LIBEL THING" cause that is a load of rubbish.

wander why you dont say who you are?

hhhmmmmmm

 

Without Prejudice

_________________

 

Obviously some traders in the UK haven't heard the term 'The Customers' always right!'. If every other industry provided the same level of service as the motor trade in general, the UK would be a 3rd world country I suspect. I don't believe that stating mere fact is in any way slanderous or deserving of LIBEL threats either.

 

These forums are here to try and pool resources, knowledge and experience among owners, old and new.

 

If some of those owners have had good or bad experiences, then they are entitled to pass that on to others, to try and enable others to hopefully make 'a right choice' when faced with sometimes a difficult and expensive decision.

 

To be fair, i have asked people to state as accurately as possible the events that led to their experience, good or bad.

 

If 'whispers in the trade' and 'forum ... tarnished image' are true, then those companies must obviously be aware of the forum.

Therefore, there is nothing stopping them coming on here to put the record straight, from their perspective.

 

Obviously i don't want that to degenerate into a slanging match between parties, i would hope that we could all be adult about it. But, if it did, then it is no problem for me to turn off some (or all) of the forums.

 

Some companies, or a representative, do already frequent the forum, and some are more vocal than others. You have to speak to be heard.

 

I am a firm believer in "3 sides to every story", and if you hear two of them, you can generally see how the 3rd side goes.

 

If we decided to never mention a good or bad company on here again, and that would also mean putting a stop to buying and selling via the forum as well, then what would that achieve ?

 

1) a dead forum ?

and/or

2) a new forum starting somewhere else ?

and/or

3) using a meeting as a means of passing on experiences, which will be just as damaging to the companies involved, only a little longer in timescale.

 

Maybe none of those, or maybe all ? But however you interpret what i am trying to say, that fact is "it would make no difference".

 

Personally, when i read that "owner Z" took his car to "company X", who charged ££££ to not find a problem, and break something else in the meantime, then i am a natural cynic and know not to take that as verbatim.

 

I have been in that situation myself, and i know how quickly bad feeling can build up, and then all is lost between the people concerned.

 

It's life, it's people. Human nature, whatever. We all live it, experience it, we've all been around.

 

If it turns out that every single company that we know of that works/supplies/deals with Z's has a list of people with both good and bad experiences, then what do we do ?

 

Start an argument off over who is lying and who is telling the truth ?

Use all of the posts to decide whether to use the company or not ?

Don't bother fixing the car and run it into the ground ?

Take it somewhere completely new and untried, and maybe start a whole new good/bad thread off ?

 

Take your pick.

 

Heck, i have a service manual, a tool set, and some friends....

 

 

I could go on and on, but i think i'll stop here.

 

I'll save the rest until later.....

 

__________________

Without prejudice.

___________________

 

As the traders voice said guys:

 

Don't complain as.....

 

"Who are you going to have to work on your cars ?"

 

But the whole point is that we don't want those companies to work on our cars.

 

Maybe a lesson in customer service will be a better option in the long run rather then a quick swot up on what LIBEL is and isn't.

 

 

If anyone wants to take it up with me personally questioning whether or not what I have posted in the past is entirely accurate...bring it on! I think I should skip the monkey and go straight to the organ grinder, Nissan UK or even contact Nissan in Japan, does anyone else want the address???

 

NISSAN MOTOR CO.,LTD

Attention: Customer Relations Department

 

17-1, Ginza 6-Chome, Chuo-ku

Tokyo 104-8023

Japan

 

NISSAN UK

01923 891555

 

 

 

Judging by the tone of this message I would guess you are one of the companies mentioned. The fact that you mentioned libel kind of gives it away.

 

Firstly, I am definitely not in the business of giving companies an unjustified reputation. I have better things to do with my time. I also don't dramatize over silly little mistakes that everyone make. What happened to me was serious and factual.

 

Secondly, I DID call after the work was carried out. The response I received was unacceptable.

 

I stand by what I said because it's the truth. I was also fair in saying that the company involved may have changed and corrected their ways.

 

My car was running poorly, Faulty det sensor, faulty O2 sensor, Timing belt way out, CAS way out and the boost is increased from 7 to 14 PSI! This caused VERY bad detonation. Please tell me I am not I my own and that everyone else feels this kind of work is justified. Please don't tell me that most other garages would consider this normal?

 

What I have been through with my car because of dodgy work - I would'nt wish on my worst enemy. My Z has been to hell and back. I owe a degree of responsibility to other forum readers especially new members. They should know about other members experinces.

 

If you had work carried out similar to what happened to my car, would you warn others? We are not talking about putting the wrong bulb in or forgetting to check the water level for the windscreen washer here. This is serious stuff. My engine is now shagged!

 

For those of you who have had great experiences with companies that have had bad reports - that fine. I'm pleased for you. I am not saying that those companies mentioned treat EVERY customer the same. That is clearly not the case otherwise they would no longer be a company. Their customer base would have died a long time ago. I am just saying that there is an element of risk because bad experiences have been reported.

 

 

 

i agree with anders, man we are like z twins almost all the same things happen to us lol.

all i can say is same old story again do a decent job and people wont complain, if you dont like that read the link from the office of fair trading that should at least make you think about "libal" lol (sorry that was really funny)

 

"wihout prejudice or malice or any bad feelings and names have been changed to protect the innocent and all charters are ficticious and not based on real events or people in this country lol"

 

Without Prejudice

 

So the Inevitable finally happens.

 

Whoever you are i sympathize with you i really do. Unfortunatly there is not a simple correct way of dealing with this.

 

We are aware of one instance already where a person may have been not completely factual about an experience,but hell as Craig Sez there are 3 sides to every story.

 

Im afraid this is a public arena, so we cannot supress the opinions of people, The accurancy stated here is entirely dependent on integrity of the poster. I trust their are not too many people out there who would deliberatly tarnish the reputation of a company. And i try to tell people if you have a problem with somewhere go to them first - if they do and are still legitimatly not happy, im afraid you have a problem in your business somewhere. If people voice a bad opinon without giving a company the chance to correct it first then that is Wrong and i will again state my objections to people voicing there opinions in this manner.

 

Our intention as a site and as enthusiasts is not to hurt the small business out there or the reputation of Nissan that make great cars. We simply aim to give information that will help our fellow memmbers.

 

Do you think you gain credibility in any case coming on here with no name (bareing in mind me and Craig can easily find out who you are from the I.P of your server) and posting your opposition to this system. If you think you have been treated unfairly by our memmbers post your name and state your side of the story, people will respect you for it rather than get more upset. This is the correct (and probably only) way of making this system work in a fair way.

 

Remmember we aren't all millionairs here nor are we all mechanically minded, i personally know of people who have lost upwards of 10 Thousand Pounds in hard earned cash thanks to dubious dealers / tuners out there.Is that Fiar ? Is that a good way to do business ? Do you think that would be funny if it was you? No you would be pissed about it in the extreme i think. As would i, I have seen enuff shit from taking my engine apart to know I don't think i would let anyone else work on the car from now on. Taped up waste gate nipples, Missing Bolts on Pre Cats, shoddy welding of joints to mate to pipes. Revese Light feed severed and TIED to the AIV piping. IF my work was that shoddy i would be a homeless bum by now. And i have yet to even make a post in the new forums.

Think about it, i realize you are not happy with the reputation that your business is obviously gettin but try and see it from our side too.

 

Please try and act in the appropriate manner in the future and hopefully things will improve. There is no need to make all this into a big flame war. If the new format has to go - it has to go, the community will continue in one form or another. At least this way you have a avenue of defence for yourself, the forum goes you loose that as communication will go 'underground' again.

Please think about the best course of action before you post again, most people here would love to find a more reliable tuner for these cars and im sure would also be willing to give a place a second chance if they new it was trying very hard to change its pass short fallings.

 

Z ya

 

Nico91TT

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just for reference and to clear things up which i think is fair,

 

The above thread was not started by a memmber of SE- Nissan or Sylvia engineering.

 

I respect the privacy of the person that posted it as that is there business, the only reason i post this is that i think some people are interpritting this as being from SE due to the mention of the name. This is not the case.

 

No one for SE Nissan has contacted me or Craig about the matter of the above - i think it is fair to them to clear this fact up now.

 

Peace out ya'll

 

Z ya

 

Nico91TT

 

 

 

 

 

fair enough i was told it was not silvia (they dont have the balls) so i take my post back from what i guessed above.

but this is now turning into a one sided slagging match, lets put it back in the bad or good experience threads

 

 

"wihout prejudice or malice or any bad feelings and names have been changed to protect the innocent and all charters are ficticious and not based on real events or people in this country lol"

 

 

oh and might i add that "the whispers amongst the trade" (i really would like to know where you come up with this stuff) lol

if they are so pissed of with what is going on why dont they do something about it, (when i tried to phone silvia about my problem i got the phone put down on me) so i figure why should i contact them, ill just never give them business again

mate you need to rethink your little post and come up with something better than this lot.

 

"wihout prejudice or malice or any bad feelings and names have been changed to protect the innocent and all charters are ficticious and not based on real events or people in this country lol"

 

 

Without prejudice (LOL, I like that)

 

>>Speaking on behalf of ALL Traders YES EVEN SE !!

 

Speaking, yes, but speaking anonymously !!

Interesting....

 

>> When you guys have finished bitching about who is shite and giving some companys a unjustified reputation

 

Well, some people deserve a little spanking

 

>>Who are you going to have to work on your cars ?

 

Get it real.....NOT YOU !

And not the average donkey/wanker/self proclaimed Z expert / I_want_your_money_but_I_don't_care_about_you type of "Nissan Mechanics".

 

To be honest, I have not one, but two Z, and given that a proprely maintained Z is very reliable (the secret is to keep them avay from self proclaimed Z specialists), I can do 90+% of the maintenance job on it.....and 100% of the tuning.

 

>> Whispers in the trade

 

Are the whispers as anonymous as you are ?

 

>> tell us that several retail outlets are >>getting pissed off with some people >>especialy when the incidence that are >>refered have never been refered back the >>the person or company concerned.

 

That's really too bad...I can tell you that in my case...they KNOW....because they're facing a judge !

 

>>One word to remind yourselves all off >>before you go blowing your horns again >>LIBEL !!

 

Sure.....good luck....btw, I have a 5 MILLION DOLLARS protection against that...have fun.

 

>>Think about it guys....lets not ruin the >>image of a truly awesome car.

 

I'm not sure you realize WHO is indeed ruining the image of this car !

 

Henri

 

you forgot to put the

 

""wihout prejudice or malice or any bad feelings and names have been changed to protect the innocent and all charters are ficticious and not based on real events or people in this country lol"

 

this guy really should not have posted this cause clearly he did not think (like when they work on your car lol) about what he wrote . im sounding like a stuck record at the moment but this has infuriated me beyond

anything , i say a boxing match is in order.

me against any of these ....... (im not saying anymore as i dont want to upset people)

 

 

"wihout prejudice or malice or any bad feelings and names have been changed to protect the innocent and all charters are ficticious and not based on real events or people in this country lol"

 

Again to bve fair to SE Nissan, in the early days of this site, there was a lot of concern about the way SE did their upgrades to the cars.

 

Peter Rosenborg posted here under his real name and tryed to justify himself and the reputation of his company. he has not posted enuff since to defence himself, this maybe because he is too busy, doesn't want to sound like a broke record or Simply Can't justify the complaints coz he doesn't see the site as a significant part of his business, i neither know nor care.

 

If he reads this tho, i would again suggest that he does answer critism on the forum, people will then get both sides of the story and a more in depth knowledge of their business.

 

Again this is simply a suggestion.....

 

Z ya

 

Nico91TT

 

 

 

p.s Henri, that post was Mint !

 

 

 

Henri,

 

It the way you tell em ;-)

 

Steve

 

300Z,

 

don't let the Traders Voice wind you up, its all been quite amuzing.

 

The Traders Voice's speech was highly arrogant and basically reinforced the way in which 'The Traders Voice' (probably) treats his customers.

 

Without prejudice etc......

 

Without Prejudice

_________________

 

I think it's highly amusing, obviously a few bad experiece posts has struck a large nerve somewhere. I wonder if certain traders hold themselves accountable for slagging fellow traders off in order to get your business? I've experieced this practice quite a few times and not just with Nissan dealers either. I think this could be down to the fact that most dealerships are franchised now, so there is quite a bit of nastiness between the same kind of people. Very fragmented which is not good for the people who have to use their services...shame really! At the end of the day they only see one thing...MONEY!

 

nah im only trying to get a responce from them lol, i just think this is a joke somewhere along the line a nerve has been struck and it is really like a little 2 year old trying to argue a point, i say lets here who these traders are so we know definatly not to go to them lol

 

 

my name is nto mentioned to protect ...... me? he he he

 

Ouch!!! HOT POTATO.

 

I love everyone. Everyone is cool.

 

Hugs and kisses

ZZZ

Johnny @ Grasshopper

 

 

lol ok johnny

 

whats i want a special on a few parts or ill let the forum loose on you.

 

300zx.

 

Anything. Just name it, but for god sake don`t let the dogs out!

 

Shit. I forgot to get back to Bob!!!!!!

 

 

LaterZ

 

Johnny