i know exactly how poor Janus must feel with the problems she has had with her Saab. I am going through something similar. I did not want to leave my beloved zebedee on a public car park whilst I was at work so I bought a y reg fiesta 1.6 zetec s from gordons ford. It was unusual to find such a good example of a 2001 model, and equally surprising to see it amongst the new cars at the dealers, albeit at a higher price than I could have purchased privately. It wasnt cheap, but the extra cost was offset by the inclusion of a full years warranty.

 

I have had problems with the car, none of which have been covered by the warranty, which to all intents and purposes is as useless as the dealers themselves have turned out to be. Despite always being calm and polite as I complained ( and keeping my partner and his friends from getting involved which would likely involve police and fire engines), my problems are now apparently passed to the owner of the company, a man I am never actually able to speak to as he is never available and never answers or replies to any calls.

 

I am obviously being treated like a woman who can be fobbed off and ignored who in their eyes will go away quietly. but it has finally reached the point where it has become obvious to me that the money was the beginning and the end of all their interest.

 

So lacking any form of satisfaction from attempting to contact them, I have instead decided to tell everyone I can of how they have treated me.

 

So, my long tale of woe and hopefully a warning to others is on my newly registered website.

http://www.gordonsford.info

It can happen that large companies loose their customer service abilities they once had as a small company but all big companies have accountability via Companies House and this is the the tool of choice to get the information to help you fight your case.

 

Company information is completely public view with no data protection involvement, once accessed you can pick bits of info out and you get directors names of which a little investigation via the internet etc. can get contact numbers, email addresses or even home address in some cases, but for that you will need to purchase information from companies house, with these details you could write diectly to the top man.

 

Your web page could give you some grief once they have their legals look at it so be prepared to take it down quick just in case

 

Follow the link below for further info:

 

http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/3e9f05e36a7c725491725af4a750f8d0/wcprodorder?ft=1

Edited August 14, 201114 yr by JeffTT

Bad customer service for sure. No denying that.

 

The law is a minefield on this. Have you been to the CAB? You would expect a "good faith" solution out most places, at least on the diff, but that doesn't look like an option.

 

I don't know if your approach will work, better to try working with Consumer Laws IMHO.

 

I do think you expect too much from the warranty, you should be concentrating on your statutory rights instead.

 

Did you read the warranty before you bought the car? You said it was a factor in your purchasing decision, so does it actually cover the faults that you expect to be fixed under it? Did someone inspect the car before you bought it?

 

The rust sucks, but unfortunately a common problem. You acknowledge this by saying you rejected similar cars for the same. It wasn't obvious when you bought the car. How bad is it? How far do you expect a workshop to strip a car to check it before sale? It's not usual to strip wheel arch linings to check the inside of panels. Has someone been blasting the wheel arches with a pressure washer? Common cause. I suspect you won't get anywhere with that.

 

Cheapest repair would be to cut them back/rust stop/weld/filler/paint. Couple of hundred £ for a decent job, will not last forever.

 

 

You repeatedly mention the heater blows hot air all the time, which by definition of how it works (and your own experience) cannot be the case. It can only blow hot air when the coolant is hot. The fault only appears when car is fully up to temp. Looks like the checked it without getting the car proper hot. Points to a lack of abilities & knowledge on whoever they sent to check it. Go back and accurately describe the problem, see if that helps. Make sure they drive the car to get it under load and proper hot. You would expect them to have done this first time around, but if they are muppets, they probably haven't.

 

The gearbox is the tricky one. Up to 6 months, they need to show it wasn't faulty at time of sale. After 6 months, you need to show that it was. If you have had it 6 months, and done 3000 miles, that will be a hard one to prove, especially now the gearbox has been stripped down by a third party, and you have then paid out your own pocket to fit a recon box.

 

I'm not sure what your problem with the 2nd place is. You asked them to investigate, they did, they billed. They have advised you that they feel you shouldn't drive it. Whats the problem? I suspect if they hadn't returned a verdict of wear & tear, you would have been happy with the service provided...

 

Your first port of call should have been CAB.

Derek something tells me you're a car dealer?

 

Unfortunately after 6 months, they're going to give you the run around. As you've found out, the warranty isn't worth wiping your arse with! I too have had similar problems in the past when I've bought cars from dealerships second hand, my GTR came from a dealership, had a 12 month warranty, when the MAF died, "wear and tear", when the wheel bearing went, "wear and tear", you get the picture. I bought a 3 year old Ford from a ford garage in New Zealand, the central locking was playing up, "Not covered by the warranty because it's a mechanical only warranty", I tried to explain that although it was electrics related, the actual solenoid was mechanical, but they were having none of it. lol

 

Unfortunately I don't think you'll get anywhere, as much as it pains me to say it, the website is probably the best approach in my opinion, as you won't be entitled to anything under the law and if you pay out to take them to court etc, you'll just end up with a big bill.

 

One of my friends bought a Nissan Navara from a Nissan dealership a few years ago, second hand, warranty for 2 years, etc. He had nothing but trouble with it, they would do nothing about it. He ended up paying someone to vinyl the car in all sorts of insults about the dealership, then parked it outside on the public road, nothing they could do about it and they lost a lot of business. Finally they caved and fixed his car free of charge and sent him on his way, under the strict condition that they could remove the vinyl, they even promised to re-spray it if they damaged the paintwork getting it off.

 

The only reason this worked was because of the business they lost, they had no obligation under law to sort it out, because their paperwork was watertight, but equally he was doing nothing illegal when he parked his truck up outside their dealership.

Ok. Problems with the car are annoying, but it's not new and has done 80k. My main prob was poor service fom dealer. I diagnosed the heater fault myself. Then took it back and showed it to them and they agreed but it's a common fault and they obviously spent less than 10 minutes with the engine on or the fault would have showed. The full extent of diagnosing the gearbox was to compare it to another car. Obviously no test drive or the heater prob would have showed itself!! But that's not the point I'm making, it's the fact I'm just being ignored. I sent this complaint letter 2 weeks ago and still have had no reply!as for the 2nd place, I have no moan with them. They did a good job. They found the probs that gordons missed had to charge. Fair enough.

As for the warranty, yes I read it and it is pretty comprehensive. Obviously if the diff was actually broken it would have been covered. As for the heater, several parts are covered but not the heater control valve which regularly breaks! And I would never have taken a 10 year old fiesta to a main dealer if it didn't have a warranty. I actually assumed it was the thrust bearing that would have been covered. That is why I was annoyed at the bill for diagnosing the gearbox problem. Without the warranty I would have just taken it straight to the gearbox place. They would have found the fault themselves and I would have saved a lot of cash so this warranty has cost me loads!!

Bad customer service for sure. No denying that.

 

The rust sucks, but unfortunately a common problem. You acknowledge this by saying you rejected similar cars for the same. It wasn't obvious when you bought the car. How bad is it? How far do you expect a workshop to strip a car to check it before sale? It's not usual to strip wheel arch linings to check the inside of panels. Has someone been blasting the wheel arches with a pressure washer? Common cause. I suspect you won't get anywhere with that.

.

 

I second a dealer related person posting the above ;)

 

But honestly, a bodge it repair to hide rust is the domain of "arfur dailey" esq.

A Ford main dealer should have properly cut out and replaced the arches with new arch panels.

The heater issue should have been identified and fixed by any competent technician trained by ford.

And a differential that badly shagged should have been replaced by a main dealer too.

 

You might expect it from a 2 bit back street garage, not from a furd dealer with associated inflated pricing.

 

I think the domain name and webpage are a good idea, how can they take any legal action if all on it is truth ?

Failing that, the option of the vinyls that Hollowpoint mentioned is a good answer too.

I wish you the best in getting some form of "closure" on this Roobarb, dealers like this need to be named and shamed !

It can happen that large companies loose their customer service abilities they once had as a small company but all big companies have accountability via Companies House and this is the the tool of choice to get the information to help you fight your case.

 

Company information is completely public view with no data protection involvement, once accessed you can pick bits of info out and you get directors names of which a little investigation via the internet etc. can get contact numbers, email addresses or even home address in some cases, but for that you will need to purchase information from companies house, with these details you could write diectly to the top man.

 

Your web page could give you some grief once they have their legals look at it so be prepared to take it down quick just in case

 

Follow the link below for further info:

 

http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/3e9f05e36a7c725491725af4a750f8d0/wcprodorder?ft=1

 

But wouldn't this apply only if it was a LTD company ~?

 

And are they?

:lol:Did think about sticking a banner to the car but I would block wigans 1 way system if I park up outside. Will have a shufty at their Bolton site tho!! And I have found a few 'review this garage' websites I can fill in! Tbh I'm not expecting to get anything out of them, but I've got nowt better to do

Ok I diagnosed the heater fault myself.

 

I've got a zetec s as well, rather than wait for them to resovle it - the heater control valve is a tenner on ebay and takes 5 mins to swap over. If its not the control valve then its the circuit board behind the heater control panel, I just repaced mine with one from the scrapyeard yesterday for £5.

Its easier to check the circuit board first, you can at least see visually if its scorched...just in case you replace control valve only to find it still blows hot!

They are great little cars for charging around in! That's a good tip bout the circuit board. Hadn't heard that and I will look. Was maybe hoping I might get gordons to do it for free to get me off their back but would probably do a better job myself!! Sure I saw some 'how to' pics on the fiesta forum

What an absolute nightmare. Can I say, contact your local Trading Standards office. They have been REALLY helpful with my issue. In fact they are in the process of contacting the garage again giving them one last chance to resolve the outstanding issues before we take them to court.

Your car will be covered by the Sale of Goods Act and the trader will need to comply with this. Check out http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/Consumerrights/Yourconsumerrightswhenbuyinggoodsandservices/DG_182935

Hope you get this sorted Roobarb, and PM me if you need any specific questions answering - have become rather well read on this subject of late :blink:

I was hoping I could borrow you to go down and shout at them:lol::lol::lol:

I was hoping I could borrow you to go down and shout at them:lol::lol::lol:

 

I didn't just shout, I banged my fist down on the desk too. That showed em lol

Unfortunately my voice gets all high pitched n squeaky when I shout so it doesn't really have the desired effect!!

They are great little cars for charging around in! That's a good tip bout the circuit board. Hadn't heard that and I will look. Was maybe hoping I might get gordons to do it for free to get me off their back but would probably do a better job myself!! Sure I saw some 'how to' pics on the fiesta forum

 

I've had loads of fun in mine, its been super chipped and has a peco exhaust so its not a zed but its still no slouch! Does for the commute and for running the dog to the park...zed for everything else though!

I replaced the heater control valve when I got it, now a couple of years later I got the same problem, ordered another one but didn't fix it! That's when I discovered it was the circuit board this time.

 

To check the circuit board, when radio removed its just two screws to remove the heater control pannel. The circuit board is held in place on the back by two small torque screws, take the board out and inspect, mine was clearly fried.

 

If the circuit board is OK then its defo the HCV, here is a link to the 'how to' - only hard bit is trying to undo the hose clips because they tend to be pretty stiff. http://www.fiestaguides.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2750

 

If it is the HCV then let me know and I'll bung one in the post to you. The one I removed was working perfectly, I just assumed it was bust until I found the problem with the circuit board...so now I have two!

Thanks. That would be great. Will have a look n let you know what I find. Ta for the link!

Derek something tells me you're a car dealer?

 

Nope. Never have been, never will. I despise the business model of most main dealer workshops. I do run a workshop with up to 70 mechanics for a huge company for a massive client. Lets call it fleet work...

 

As you've found out, the warranty isn't worth wiping your arse with!

 

Most are not. OP seemed to be surprised at this, hence my questions. Very rarely are they worth the money.

 

Unfortunately I don't think you'll get anywhere, as much as it pains me to say it, the website is probably the best approach in my opinion, as you won't be entitled to anything under the law

 

Yup - Law should have been first point of contact as soon as the problems came up and the dealer ignored her. Would be difficult to take that route now after the time that has passed and repairs have been done.

 

I second a dealer related person posting the above ;)

 

Not at all. I fully support the OP, but I am also a realist. She went about things the wrong way for a successful win.

 

A Ford main dealer should have properly cut out and replaced the arches with new arch panels.

 

Should they? Is it really their responsibility to repair after 6 months? By the OP's own admission, the rust wasn't there when the car was sold. Cars rust. Fords particularly bad. OP new this. They offered a halfway solution.

 

a bodge it repair to hide rust is the domain of "arfur dailey" esq.

 

Nonsense. First of all, in the words of Clarkson "How bad can it be?" If there was no sign at purchase, it cant be that bad now - unless there is some reason for the rusting to be accelerated, hence my questions regarding jet wash etc. Now read again what I wrote. "cut them back/rust stop/weld/filler/paint" Done properly by a pro, not as a DIY kerbside repair, it would be invisible. I bet most Zeds on here have had similar.

 

The heater issue should have been identified and fixed by any competent technician trained by ford.

 

Absolutely. We are working on the assumption that it wasn't an apprentice, desk jokey or otherwise a complete muppet. By the OP's own account, she told them it does it all the time, when it clearly doesn't. If it only does it when it is proper hot, she should have told them that. They need to go sit in traffic or for a proper drive. Never going to achieve the conditions sat idling in a car park.

 

And a differential that badly shagged should have been replaced by a main dealer too.

 

I agree completely. OP was told "they all sound like that" when the car was bought. The correct thing to do would have been to refuse the car and insist on a repair or return. By driving 3000 miles, it could be argued that was a sign of acceptance of the vehicle, and could have contributed to the failure.

 

 

You might expect it from a 2 bit back street garage, not from a furd dealer with associated inflated pricing.

 

Shady under the arches garages - yes

Main dealers - yes

 

They are both the same unfortunately. Profit by volume. The only difference is dealers dress better. I always recommend using small independent workshops that don't have a huge interest in car sales and maintenance is their number 1 priority, where the owner is usually the guy fixing your car.

 

These places rely on a good reputation, good first time fix rate, repeat business, and building a personal relationship with their customers. (Coincidentally, the sort of business model that one of the more successful traders on here employs.)

 

dealers like this need to be named and shamed !

 

Agreed. Also recommend consulting with the CAB, Trading Standards, the Institute of the Motor Industry, the dealers particular House Marque, and any other professional bodies and schemes that they claim to be a member of. But do it in a timely fashion, in accordance with published consumer guidelines. Sometimes that is the only effective way to get the desired result.

 

as for the 2nd place, I have no moan with them. They did a good job. They found the probs that gordons missed had to charge. Fair enough.

 

Reading your website, it just seemed like you were offended that they charged. Bear in mind that although they fly the Ford flag as part of the dealer network, they are nothing to do with the original dealer. If you are happy with their service, why are the named on your list of complaints?

 

 

OP, please don't think I am getting on at you. I fully agree you have been wronged, and that the dealer should take some responsibility. To be clear, IMHO, they should have carried the can for the heater valve and the diff. The rust - not so much.

 

You would have stood a better chance had you followed all the advice given to consumers regarding disputes in a timely fashion. For some reason you seem to have ignored the freely available good advice, and time is now against you.

 

When buying used vehicles, always do the following;

 

1/ Have an independent inspection. By that, i mean AA, RAC, proper trusted mechanic, or similar. Not a mate that knows a bit about cars.

 

2/ HPI check, check all docs, paperwork, service history, old MOTs etc.

 

3/ Test drive. If in any doubt whatsoever, walk away. There are loads of cars to choose from out there.

 

4/ Never buy on impulse. Take your time, sleep on the decision. If the sales staff are being overbearing, walk away.

 

5/ In the case of any disputes, take it to the Dealer Principle straight away. Salesmen won't help. Service department cant help. If that doesn't work, straight to CAB.

I have to go to work now so I've not got time to reply to this fully, but can I say this fiesta is my 25th car so I'm not a complete retread when it comes to car buying! I was told the transmission sounded normal when I took it in for repair, not when I bought it. I did tell them it took a few minutes for the heater problem to kick in. Cant put everything I said to them in this post but I think you're being pedantic there. Heaters set to cold. It's blowing boiling hot should be enough. If I could have spoke personally to md I would have. Certainly wasn't for lack of trying. Wasted alot of time liaising with ford direct, fords complaint department who promised they could do something to sort it. Can add them to my list of useless ford people :mad2:

Nobody called you a "retread", or implied that you were. The buying advice given above was meant as a general guide for anyone, I didn't intend it to seem directed at you alone.

 

Same as the advice on complaint resolution. Peeps should lever the law as early as possible. Janus took the advice of folks very early when she had an issue with her SAAB and spoke with various consumer groups. I don't know what the outcome was, but she definitely has a very good chance of a proper resolution.

 

What I was politely trying to say in a roundabout way is you went completely the wrong way about it with regards to continuing to drive the car, and paying out of pocket for investigation and repair of the diff. If you had followed the advice that is freely available all over the internet you would have most likely had your money back by now.

 

As I have stated above, I agree that the heater issue should have been diagnosed by any competent mechanic. You think I am being pedantic - I think I am being accurate. But that's not what the argument is about, so let's not fight!

Your right . If I did it again I would do it differently. I honestly believed the thrust bearing was at fault which would have been covered and avoided going back to gordons. I work shifts so I need a car and couldn't have it off the road whilst I went the legal route. Getting it done independantly was a bit of a knee jerk reaction. At least I know it's been well repaired. Tbh you're always gonna be spending money on whatever car you drive I just don't like being ignored!!

Whahey!! Finally, 5 weeks after my 1st letter and 2 weeks after I sent it again, recorded delivery, mr Gordon phoned today :biggrin: to tell me he will phone me back tomorrow about my shonky fiesta :mellow:

Apparently he knew nowt about it. Yeah right! Anyway it's progress I suppose

Whahey!! Finally, 5 weeks after my 1st letter and 2 weeks after I sent it again, recorded delivery, mr Gordon phoned today :biggrin: to tell me he will phone me back tomorrow about my shonky fiesta :mellow:

Apparently he knew nowt about it. Yeah right! Anyway it's progress I suppose

 

Thats good news roob:thumbup:

Great news, be sure to update!

Nothing to report on my stinky Saab, which still sucks

Went to see the big boss today about the probs I've had with my fiesta and the fact my complaints have been ignored. Upshot is they are fixing my heater and agree the rear wings need replacing and are looking into the best way to get it sorted. Good ol Mr Gordon :biggrin:

Edited September 9, 201114 yr by roobarb

Good stuff! I think we can safely say we've all learnt something here today..

 

Never let a woman buy a car... :lol: