Well???

 

Please dont mention Japspeed crap.Or Powerflow or Longlife tat either. I dont want one with bends formed with a hammer and a blowtorch.

Mongoose/Blueflame not capable of handling the volume of gas.Diameter too small

 

Alunox custom system?? Yes I know about this option. I have seen two fabulous examples.

 

So...?????

Shouldn't need to be too fancy for that of BHP fella. Mine ran 580 horses and 600 torques with a custom s/s system, 2.5 inch all the way through with just large back boxes, was never a problem.

 

No experience of the off the shelf stuff.

 

If there really is no compromise on your project then speak to Nortech and get them to knock you up a custom titanium jobby :thumbup: Will flow whatever you can throw at it and be mega light too - and bluey tinged :cool::cool:

I'm assuming that it's only the VG30DETT that struggles to make 500bhp running with cheaper exhausts?

 

I know of several RB25 and SR motors running Japspeed exhausts, all of which are putting down in excess of 500bhp

 

The GTS-T owned by 'SPRINTER' on SKYLINEOWNERS.COM (which was tuned by Rising Sun Performance) for example makes 505.9 bhp (and that's diffy the second blower and about 50 brake from stock that the VG offers)

 

Nothing special in the spec list either:

 

RSP 500 bhp turbo kit

greddy down pipe

japspeed exhaust with extra cat silencer

RSP thicker steel head gasket

some light gas flow work to the head by myself

Deatschworks 650cc injectors

Apexi power FC

Z32 AFM

Greddy FMIC

Greddy boost controller

Greddy oil cooler

japspeed 60mm radiator

Apexi intake

super sqv bov

 

 

Must be the FMIC eh! :innocent:

I'm assuming that it's only the VG30DETT that struggles to make 500bhp running with cheaper exhausts?

 

don't think that's true, just that some exhaust are better than others :) the real area is the downpipe though, some big gains available there

don't think that's true, just that some exhaust are better than others :) the real area is the downpipe though, some big gains available there

 

That's the point I'm trying to make bud

 

When I said "I'm assuming that it's only the VG30DETT that struggles to make 500bhp running with cheaper exhausts?"

 

it was a question expressing my doubt

 

 

I totally agree that some exhausts are better than others, but having said that, better design and better quality of materials are two totally different things.

 

 

Surely it's quite possible that a company such as JAPSPEED that makes a large quantity of exhausts (using slightly cheaper materials) but incorporating a design based on their own/and others research and development and the informed feedback from the end user (ie. customer/drifter/track driver etc) could potentially be as good if not better than a more high profile company that doesn't strive to improve on their design on a regular basis because their product is made from higher quality materials and has always been better then their competitors product in the past.

 

Designs are improving constantly but that does not mean to say that the best design won't be copied and mass produced by others, who may then reproduce that product using either inferior quality materials and/or implement higher rates of production overseas.

 

Loads of people swear by the STILLEN kit, but a lot of that is just copied design!

 

 

 

I just can't see why 'it's a given' that a £1,000 exhaust offers better performance than a cheaper exhaust of similar design

 

Some guys in the States are running chopped steel side pipes on a variety of rides and are running sub 8 second quarters????

It's just not a given in my oppinion that a higher price tag and a brand name is always the better option for performance gains

 

 

Just my 2p worth

First things first, stop brand whoring - spending 7-10k on an exhaust (don't think I'm plucking that figure out my head, quite a few systems cost that much if not more when it comes to exotic materials) is quite un-necessary when going for such a low power figure. Secondly, there is no need whatsoever to import a whole exhaust system. 500-600bhp is nothing crazy and doesn't need the finest engineering. Stainless is stainless whether it's made by a magical pixie in toyko and sold under HKS, or whether it's sourced from a building site!

 

In answer to your question, work out where you're wanting the power first, low end or high end - going big and free flowing is going to result in a lack of torque whichever way you slice it, but the opposite is going to result in a lower peak bhp figure. Find some good quality smooth elbows/downpipes first, thats your most important call and go by first-hand recommendation, and this is where you want to spend the money - then get a custom shop with a good reputation to make you a smooth 3" exhaust system from there back (should be around 300-400 pounds), the SWB doesn't have a petrol tank to get in the way so use it to your advantage. If it's a track toy you may aswell have 2 single smooth boxless pipes. If a road car a similar design would be good with low restriction backboxes at the rear and inline bullet boxes inbetween. Then ceramic coat it/ wrap it. Job done.

Jap slapper, Re read my post above, as regards the Zed Japspeed system along with many many other exhaust manufactuer's simply copying the existing design of a stock system.

 

That is no real big deal and you can have a 700bhp Zed with 1 of the above, however if you want the exhaust to perform as well possible and as well as the engine given the length and bends required in our system, THEN, the likes of the other named companies mentioned above come in to play.

 

You can see the major difference in the pics i posted above, now the companies who make these expensive systems don't have to hand the buying power in China where most systems are robotically made, i have somewhere a name of a company who make all the parts by the 100 or 1000 for these cheaper supplied units.

 

All Pete is trying to achive here is the best possible performing exhaust he can get, with that it means paying top ££, some will pay it and some won't.

hth

smithy

Well???

 

Please dont mention Japspeed crap.Or Powerflow or Longlife tat either. I dont want one with bends formed with a hammer and a blowtorch.

Mongoose/Blueflame not capable of handling the volume of gas.Diameter too small

 

Alunox custom system?? Yes I know about this option. I have seen two fabulous examples.

 

So...?????

 

mine. :)

I appreciate exactly what Pete is trying to achieve here and though it's neither here nor there, I agree totally with the thinking behind it; buy the best exhaust you can afford that permits maximum performance gains.

 

but which exhaust to go for? (hence this thread)

 

However the point was raised elsewhere; outside of this thread (that 500bhp from a VG30DETT is entirely achievable with a number of off the shelf systems) so with that in mind; unless the intention is to push beyond that figure in the future, is there any requirement to spend a grand on something that will ultimately permit you to achieve the same results as a selected number of off the shelf systems?

 

It would appear that we VG owners are getting left behind by our smaller RB and SR cousins with regards to extracting substantial figures from our engines.

(Please note, if you're quite content with the 400 brake that you have currently achieved with your 'Z'; and that is not a derogatary comment, then this obviously bares no relevance to you so please feel free to hold comment)

 

 

I only used JAPSPEED as an example as they provide a very good exhaust for the 'S' body and Skyline guys (I'm sure this is in part due to a lot more feedback from the user)

I don't claim that by using the JAPSPEED system on the 'Z', that it will permit 500 brake, I only used 'SPRINTERS' GTS-T as an example of where the JAPSPEED system was capable of producing that figure.

 

 

I think it's a great project to get stuck into and hope that all go's well

 

though I'm not entirely sure that any 'Z' owner would consider spending £7k-£10k on an exhaust system, as the words 'tight', 'duck' and 'hoop' spring to mind :thumbup1:

No exhaust is going to "stop" you getting 500 horses. Slap on a set of big tubs and the stock exhaust will allow enough flow, Its just a peak power figure.

 

There are far more important considerations - Turbo Spool, and the entire power and torque curves - are all affected by the exhaust system.

 

Most cheap of the shelf systems are just copies of the stock exhaust system, but in a slightly larger diameter - Which is a pretty poor design for efficiency with excessive 90degree angles.

 

I'd even be suprised if the likes of Japspeed had even actually seen a 300zx, I suspect they just got hold of a stock or other aftermarket exhaust system and copied it from that. Their systems are very good value for money, but quality control with their products is an ongoing issue in my experience.

 

My money would go on a specialtyz system or a custom system from one of the many exhaust fabricators out there who will design the system on the car for best flow.

Stainless is stainless whether it's made by a magical pixie in toyko and sold under HKS, or whether it's sourced from a building site!

 

No its not. THere are many different grades of Stainless steel and the cheaper suppliers naturally tend to opt for the cheaper grades, and will corrode.

Surely a shorter front exit/side exit configuration would be the best option for performance?

 

 

What issues would this raise, besides increased Db levels?

No its not. THere are many different grades of Stainless steel and the cheaper suppliers naturally tend to opt for the cheaper grades, and will corrode.

 

most of the time its the quality of the welds that are the issue rather then the quality of the tube used. pretty much all of the stainless systems i have seen use 304 stainless which is an easier to cold form grade. 316 which is what i use frequently in my profession is harder to cold form and generally cracks after time with the constant heating and cooling effect.316 contains more Molybdenum then 304 As such, molybdenum is one of the single most useful alloying additives in the fight against corrosion. in exhaust systems however can be a bit probelmatic on joints 304 is used as it can be more durable but not from corrosion.

Edited July 9, 201015 yr by hellraiser

No its not. THere are many different grades of Stainless steel and the cheaper suppliers naturally tend to opt for the cheaper grades, and will corrode.

 

Very true point - but performance wise it's all the same, my point was more that I couldn't justify the price of a stainless system purely because it came from a top-brand jap tuner, over a stainless system using locally sourced steel and a competent and experienced exhaust fabricator.

 

:thumbup:

Surely a shorter front exit/side exit configuration would be the best option for performance?

 

 

What issues would this raise, besides increased Db levels?

 

hot feet LOL

Phil Morrison at DW has a good custom front exit setup on his 2JZ GTE powered S15, which I guess is running about 550 bhp

 

*and yes it's not feeling too well at the moment following a three car 'bump' last weekend, but they're fixing it as we speak*

 

My 2ps worth again, as a few people have said, many exhausts will flow perfectly well enough to supply you 500+bhp. However, not wanting to be one who misses the point of a thread I'm getting a bit confused.

 

If money is no object then go for a custom, titanium system that the manufacturer consults you on with regards your requirements, spool/top end/torque blah blah blah and spend a fortune.

 

If you just want an exhaust that will not restrain you from acheiving 500bhp+ then pick anyhting from the mentions above - it really isn't a biggy, unless you're tyring to achieve 500 ponies with nothing more than an exhaust, at which point the straightest, most free flowing, best grade s/s zorst ain't gonna get you there.

 

At the end of the day I don't really mind what zorst you go for chap, but it seems that if you want advice, the advice from me, who's car has run well in excess of 500bhp is that you don't need to waste your money on something stoopid expensive. FYI I was running std elbows. Will post dyno sheets when i can be arsed to scan them in, prob over the weekend. Smithy's comments I think are valuable, as are japslappers. At the end of the day bud 500bhp is easy with a half decent engine and tubs so spend your money elsewhwere, get a decent zorst and enjoy it :) Brand snobbery etc shouldn't even figure

 

PS mine's for sale - you can give me £2k for that and I guarantee it will do 1200bhp :rofl:

PS mine's for sale - you can give me £2k for that and I guarantee it will do 1200bhp :rofl:

 

 

I can vouch for 'MONSTERS' workmanship, he built my mates exhaust for his motor

 

 

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

 

yeah but he didn't go for the full ground effect option

 

(dont know how to post pics properly so hope the link works)

 

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.liftruck.co.uk/images/dynamow/DCP00652.JPG&imgrefurl=http://www.liftruck.co.uk/dynamow_hydrostatic_lawn_mower.htm&usg=__19z-krtAW2VMHGncg2yB5UJbSR8=&h=864&w=1152&sz=208&hl=en&start=98&itbs=1&tbnid=mntPJcTmVllG4M:&tbnh=113&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dride%2Bon%2Bmower%2Bback%26start%3D84%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN%26gbv%3D2%26ndsp%3D21%26tbs%3Disch:1

no it doesn't, there's a great rear shot of that bad boy lol

^^^^^^ Posting at 2 O'clock on a Saturday morning

 

We seriously all need to get out more I think

 

 

Maybe I can chip in here. It the engine out of red car which will be planted into the slicktop. It's a new project which Pete is helping me with. The engine already achieves over 500 rwhp and that's with the boost turned down and the NOS turned off. It has recently completed just over 3000 miles without the need for a service and manages to do a lot of things well but none of them perfectly. In other words it's a compromise between an all out track car and an all out road car. I am asking the same of the new car. My criteria was that it could just as easily do a trip to the riviera, silverstone, or santa pod without worrying about being high maintenance. The red car kind of achieved this but failed a bit on the track due to brake and oil surge issues. Oh yes, also down to Michelin PS2 tyres not quite being a good as the price tag lol. These issues will be sorted for the new project.

 

A cheaper exhaust may well achieve the performance but I'm also needing reliability and long life. If I can get what I want for £200 then I'll gladly take it. I'm not a brand snob and neither is Pete just don't want to be let down by shoddy parts. And if we need to wait a little longer for what we need or pay a little bit more then that's what we'll do. And of course it sadly means I'll have to do some overtime :(

 

Anybody want a single exit exhaust lol

^nout wrong with a single exit lol.. what type you got?

^nout wrong with a single exit lol.. what type you got?

 

Custom exhaust twin 3" pipes

HKS superdragger back box (5" single exit)

 

Yes i agree nothing wrong at all and sounds amazing. I really want my new car to stay close to the original lines as far as the bodywork goes and therefore has to be twin exit :)

super dragger all the way