Hi all, Right where to start well i have recently done an auto to manual gearbox conversion on my new Z, everything is great! exept for the fact the damn clutch just will not bleed and it's doing my bloody nut in :headvswal im really at the point where im gonna put a sledge to it :rant:.

 

Iv'e done the search bit and came up with nothing that can help really so here we go.

 

It's a TT and i used my old manual breaker as the doner car, i fitted the TT clutch system with the booster and all the original clutch pipework including the bleeder valve behind the driver headlight.

 

When i first finished the conversion we tried to bleed the clutch but could get barely no pedal pressure during the process even though there seemed to be no air left in the system and we'd run almost 1.5 litres of fluid through it, but the pedal would lose the minimal pressure it had after 6-8 pumps then come back after a couple more pumps (strange), so i had a chat to Mike feeney and he said it maybe sounded like the master cylinder seals were at fault so i bought a new seal kit for it, once id fitted that and bled another 1.5 litres of fluid through it there was no difference whatsoever. At this point i was pulling my hair out, or whats left of it lol. So i decided to go for a new clutch slave cylinder which arrived today :hyper: , I fitted the slave cylinder with a big smile on my face hoping that this would be it and it would bleed ok and id have my Z on the road but NO :headvswal , after spending another 2 hours or so bleeding the clutch again and running another 1.5 litres of fluid through it lots of air was removed from the system and there was a bit more pedal pressure than any of the previous times trying to bleed it still no clutch, no movement on the slave cylinder/clutch fork at all, at this point i literally went looking for the sledge :mad: :mad:, im at my wits end with this now and desperately could do with some help here iv'e put alot of effort into this car and cannot believe iv'e been defeated by the clutch not bleeding of all things....somebody please help what could be wrong..

 

Oh and i don't know if it makes any difference but when i had a little pressure on the clutch pedal today and i started the car i lost all pressure on the pedal it went light as a feather litteraly there was just the weight of the pedal and no pressure, I assumed that this meant the clutch booster system is working ok, but ill wait to be corrected on that one....... any help is greatly appreciated.....thankyou in advance.

I had this a couple of years back. Total frustration- new seals/ slave cyl etc. I had to bleed at the Slave cyl nipple first then back up at the bleed nipple on the drivers inner wing panel and that sorted it.

Iv'e tried bleeding in that order sooo many times now bled the slave then the upper nipple, again and again with no luck, I had to give up due to backache in the end....

Iv'e tried bleeding in that order sooo many times now bled the slave then the upper nipple, again and again with no luck, I had to give up due to backache in the end....

 

Have you looked at the check valve thats on the vac hose that comes off the balance bar?

Is it installed the correct way, the balance bar end is the end thats at a 90deg to the main body of the valve.

From the clutch booster side you should be able to blow through it but not suck through it.

Not 100% sure its your problem but it could be.

Ed

Rip out all the unnecessary Hydraulic pipe work and and replace with a single piece of braided line straight from the master to the slave.

 

Then just bleed it on the slave cylinder. So much simpler!

Have you looked at the check valve thats on the vac hose that comes off the balance bar?

Is it installed the correct way, the balance bar end is the end thats at a 90deg to the main body of the valve.

From the clutch booster side you should be able to blow through it but not suck through it.

Not 100% sure its your problem but it could be.

Ed

 

 

Cheers Ed ill have a look in the morning, i think it;s all ok as i never split any of the hoses when i swoped from doner car to this one, but ill doule check anyhow....

Rip out all the unnecessary Hydraulic pipe work and and replace with a single piece of braided line straight from the master to the slave.

 

Then just bleed it on the slave cylinder. So much simpler!

 

 

Ok so would it be the original clutch piping setup thats the cause of my problem??

 

Where would i get this braided hose? is it a custom job or do any of the traders supply them, if custom by chance do you know what length it needs to be and what the end fillings/threads are?

 

Cheers jay

Its much simpler to bleed it without all the extra pipework and the extra bleed valve under the bay. Bleeding the clutch can be a real headache with the standard stuff.

 

It would need to be custom. I had it all written down from when I did mine, but I cant find it now :headvswal Its prob best to take the old pipework with you to get it made up. It does'nt need to be any longer than 1.5meter

 

You want the same stuff they use for Brake lines. High pressure stuff.

Its much simpler to bleed it without all the extra pipework and the extra bleed valve under the bay. Bleeding the clutch can be a real headache with the standard stuff.

 

It would need to be custom. I had it all written down from when I did mine, but I cant find it now :headvswal Its prob best to take the old pipework with you to get it made up. It does'nt need to be any longer than 1.5meter

 

You want the same stuff they use for Brake lines. High pressure stuff.

 

 

See before i installed the original pipework i done some research and found out that it should have been easier to bleed the clutch with the original pipework, im so annoyed now cos it took bloddy ages to fit the damn stuff :rant: , but anyhow looks like ill have to remove the stuff now n go get a custom hose made up.. Do you remember how much you paid for your clutch hose Legrath so i know im not gettin screwed on price....cheers

I remember having mega problems getting the clutch to work after my last rebuild on the red car....

 

Tried to bleed it here there and everywhere. Tried to flush fluid upwards etc.

 

In total desperation I pressed the slave cylinder all the way in by hand and my Dad pumped the clutch once. The slave cylinder had a much longer travel this time, so Dad pumped it again and it reached it's 'working point' on the clutch fork.

 

I have no idea why that should work but it did, I'd suggest you try it too.

 

ATB

 

Rob.

I had a similar problem but I don't have all the additional pipework due to an auto/man conversion. I did replace the seals in the master cylinder which didn't seem to make any difference. In the end I decided that air gets trapped in the end of the master cylinder as it is angled upwards slightly. Can't remember what I did exactly, but take a look and see if yours is similar - jacking up the back of the car may help.

 

I have a feeling that some master cylinders have an additional bleed point on the end - mine doesn't.

I remember having mega problems getting the clutch to work after my last rebuild on the red car....

 

Tried to bleed it here there and everywhere. Tried to flush fluid upwards etc.

 

In total desperation I pressed the slave cylinder all the way in by hand and my Dad pumped the clutch once. The slave cylinder had a much longer travel this time, so Dad pumped it again and it reached it's 'working point' on the clutch fork.

 

I have no idea why that should work but it did, I'd suggest you try it too.

 

ATB

 

Rob.

 

Hi Rob, Ill give your suggestion a try tommorrow hopefull when it's stopped raining, the weather here has been so off and on it's been annoying.......

I had a similar problem but I don't have all the additional pipework due to an auto/man conversion. I did replace the seals in the master cylinder which didn't seem to make any difference. In the end I decided that air gets trapped in the end of the master cylinder as it is angled upwards slightly. Can't remember what I did exactly, but take a look and see if yours is similar - jacking up the back of the car may help.

 

I have a feeling that some master cylinders have an additional bleed point on the end - mine doesn't.

 

 

Hi Andy, You may have a point there i think the front end has been a bit higher everytime iv'e tried to bleed the clutch so ill give this a shot tommorrow hopefully if the weather gets better, my master cylinder doesnt have a bleed point on the master cylinder, so thats a no go........cheers Jay

I had a similar problem but I don't have all the additional pipework due to an auto/man conversion. I did replace the seals in the master cylinder which didn't seem to make any difference. In the end I decided that air gets trapped in the end of the master cylinder as it is angled upwards slightly. Can't remember what I did exactly, but take a look and see if yours is similar - jacking up the back of the car may help.

 

I have a feeling that some master cylinders have an additional bleed point on the end - mine doesn't.

 

later cars and most replacement cylinders now sold have a bleed valve on the end. This makes the job easier.

the other main problem IMO is the fact that the bleed valve on the slave cylinder is BELOW where the pipe comes in, thereby leaving a potential air bubble above it.

I had a similar problem but I don't have all the additional pipework due to an auto/man conversion. I did replace the seals in the master cylinder which didn't seem to make any difference. In the end I decided that air gets trapped in the end of the master cylinder as it is angled upwards slightly. Can't remember what I did exactly, but take a look and see if yours is similar - jacking up the back of the car may help.

 

I have a feeling that some master cylinders have an additional bleed point on the end - mine doesn't.

 

Would this cause it to still have nothing on the pedal ?

Clutch is now bled :hyper: :nana2: :hyper: , I jacked up the rear of the car about a foot as suggested and bled and bled for over an hour with help from the missis on the pedal we started to get a little movement on the clutch fork but no more, so decided to try it with the engine running than I noticed that while the missis was pumping the pedal with all bleed nipples closed that there was lots and lots and lots of air bubbles rising back up into the master cylinder so we carried on pumping for a fair while thinking that the air coming back through the master cylinder was air trapped in it as suggested previously in the thread but after 2 hours we had to question this :confused: , so i decided to disconnect the clutch booster vacume system from the booster and blocking off both ends, then believe it or not the clutch started to bleed properly, we had pedal pressure almost instanlty, so carried on bleeding and every pump it was getting that little closer to being perfect but it still took another hour and a half to get it to go into gear without any problems....yiiipppppeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee :hyper: :hyper: . I gotta say though the clutch is well heavy without the booster vacume system connected and ive only got a standard setup in there too.

 

So I think the conclusion is that the clutch booster system was the problem all along and must have been drawing air into the hydraulic side of it somehow which was not allowing it to bleed.......so if i had a choice again and the parts were readily available i would junk the TT clutch pedal booster setup and go for the NA setup........Cheers for all you suggestions guys the sledge is now safely locked away for the foreseeable future..... :D

good stuff mate at least its sorted

Maybee too late to reply as its fixed but one method of bleeding hydraulic systems is to back bleed from the slave up to the reservoir by using a 12volt washer pump, I used to use this method for bleeding clutches and it worked every time. Also if you dont have full travel on the pedal, let gravity help by for a split second opening the bleed screw on the slave cylinder and watching for air seeping out.

 

HTH Cheers John

Nice one... :hyper: