Thought I should move this from the 'Journal' forum and update where the project is at. Wish I was at Coventry with everyone, but these things always take longer than anticipated, lol

 

20/01/2013

Having had the car for a few years now I have finally given in to the urge for more power.

 

The original engine in the car runs superbly only 66k miles with a proven Dyno run @ 357bhp, with boost jets and a uprated chip & air filter. Not bad at all for a 300ZX, but I was bitten by the bug and was set on going for more bhp and reliability, (I know why fiddle with it if it ain't broke). But having been lucky enough to have many nice high powered cars in recent years I wanted to keep the Zed long term and the engine is the first part of the project so it need's to be a good strong/reliable build.

 

After looking at various options of buying a part built engine form the US I decide to also keep my eyes peeled for the poteintial of purchasing an uncompleted project rebuild.

 

Back in March/April 2012 an ebay listing caught my eye regarding a nearly completed forged engine rebuild. The only problem with it was that the rebuild wasn't exactly completed by the most reputable of Zed engine builders known within the Zed world. In fact the seller had been caught up in horrific events where parts when missing, work was never finished and finally the garage was broken into and his engine was stolen. Retrieved from a nearby field 24 hours after going "missing". see here for a bit more http://www.300zx.co.uk/forums/showth...light=s+mochan

After talking with the seller for sometime we struck a deal and I waited for the day when the pallet with the engine would arrive.

 

It came with forged internals, Wiseco pistons, Eagle rods, ACL Duralite white metal bearings ARP main con rods and head bolts, Tomie 260 degree camshafts with solid lifters & harder springs, SARD 850cc injectors with a Border fuel rails/ new Turbo's, s/steel manifolds, new oil pump, heads polished, exhausts ports and valves shimed & lapped.

 

Didn't look all that great mind when it finally arrived to be honest, and I still had my doubts as to whether I had done the right thing in buying this.

 

 

 

After stripping down the engine as far I was prepared to take it anyway,

 

 

 

 

 

I wasn't going to attempt to go much further, so I thought it would be best to get this done properly!

 

So a call was made to Jim @ PowerZed to arrange a date to get everything to him in order for him to work his magic.

Well if nothing else I'm now really paranoid and worried about my build now, been looking forward to being in this position for years, now can't shake the felling it's all a mistake....

Well if nothing else I'm now really paranoid and worried about my build now, been looking forward to being in this position for years, now can't shake the felling it's all a mistake....

 

No, no don`t think that, the build is not the issue, what you try and extract from it is the rub, keep it reigned in and not only will you protect your investment but I truelly believe you will enjoy driving it more, its sort of nice knowing its not working to its max. it will have a wider usable torque band with even wider smile rewards......:biggrin:.

 

Jeff

Edited May 6, 20169 yr by JeffTT

Well if nothing else I'm now really paranoid and worried about my build now, been looking forward to being in this position for years, now can't shake the felling it's all a mistake....

 

:innocent: I'll take your parts:innocent: :lol:

No, no don`t think that, the build is not the issue, what you try and extract from it is the rub, keep it reigned in and not only will you protect your investment but I truelly believe you will enjoy driving it more, its sort of nice knowing its not working to its max. it will have a much wider usable torque band with wider smile rewards...

 

Jeff

 

Agreed:yes: I'm not getting a remap to get big horsepower, I'm getting it to make the car as drive able as possible by making all my modifications work in unison with each other:yes:

:innocent: I'll take your parts:innocent: :lol:

 

 

 

That`s bad ...lol

 

 

Jeff

Agreed:yes: I'm not getting a remap to get big horsepower, I'm getting it to make the car as drive able as possible by making all my modifications work in unison with each other:yes:

 

Absolutely spot on Richie, you will certainly benefit from the build that way and not be worrying about reliability issues.

 

Jeff

:innocent: I'll take your parts:innocent: :lol:

 

That`s bad ...lol

 

 

Jeff

 

Ha!! I'm hoping Ash knows I'm only joking with him:thumbup: (But seriously, call me!!) (:laugh:Only joking Ash:lol:)

Absolutely spot on Richie, you will certainly benefit from the build that way and not be worrying about reliability issues.

 

Jeff

 

I always worry about reliability issues, have you not seen the luck I've had with this car:tt2:

I've read this thread with varying emotions and as with several other people feel compelled to comment.

My take on the situation is as follows.

The 300zx lends itself to 3 guises in my opinion (only my opinion guys)

 

1-Absolutely standard as it came out of the box, a soon to be future classic and should be treated as such (you wouldn't rag the tits of your e-type, well all right some of you would!)

2-Close to standard with few mods such as wheels, maybe leather interior, exhaust etc. These are the cars that I think people enjoy the most on a regular basis. With the most driveability.

3-Loud Shouty fire breathing monsters that will spit you sideways at the drop of a hat and fight you all the way down the road. I'm including anything over 450BHP in this and yes I know some of these cars are very driveable.

 

The Zed works well for all of the above and is capable with the right mods of generating huge horsepower.

However you have to accept that if you plump for option 3 you are pushing the limits and as such things will fail, most of these cars are pushing 25 years old now.

The problem is we all want to spend £5000 to compete with a £50,000 car.

I do accept that traders shouldn't walk away from problems, and on a forum like this people will vote with their feet.

But as they say "you can't please all the people all the time"

Customer service is how you deal with the problems not how you deal with sales.

I feel very much for people who have a problem with their pride and joy, but until now the posts and threads I have read on here all have a camaraderie about them which is definitely missing here.

Whilst the forum is a great place to air views and comment, do we not think this has turned into a bun fight.

 

As a foot note I own an option 3, and yes it is currently broken, but that was always in mind for me (bought a more powerful engine to transplant which of course at some point I will break as well)

However funds allowing by the end of the year I hope to own an option 2 as well.

As a foot note I own an option 3, and yes it is currently broken, but that was always in mind for me (bought a more powerful engine to transplant which of course at some point I will break as well)

However funds allowing by the end of the year I hope to own an option 2 as well.

 

Another one??? :lol:

Well put, I won't be looking for big horsepower, all you have to do is take a look at the likes of Funkysi's, JoelyP's, Andrew's, Gaz's and Ian's cars (to name a few) which have been tastefully modified with (in some cases) Jimmer built engines, chips, exhausts, maps etc, They're all running reliably because the lads didn't go looking for crazy BHP figures, what they did do is build cars that they can enjoy without the worry of breaking down, Hell, I think there's quite a few Jimmer built engines running reliably for 7-10+ years:thumbup:

I'll take reliability over horsepower any day of the week:thumbup:

Well put, I won't be looking for big horsepower, all you have to do is take a look at the likes of Funkysi's, JoelyP's, Andrew's, Gaz's and Ian's cars (to name a few) which have been tastefully modified with (in some cases) Jimmer built engines, chips, exhausts, maps etc, They're all running reliably because the lads didn't go looking for crazy BHP figures, what they did do is build cars that they can enjoy without the worry of breaking down, Hell, I think there's quite a few Jimmer built engines running reliably for 7-10+ years:thumbup:

I'll take reliability over horsepower any day of the week:thumbup:

 

Could not of said it better Richie !!

 

Jeff

 

I feel very much for people who have a problem with their pride and joy, but until now the posts and threads I have read on here all have a camaraderie about them which is definitely missing here.

Whilst the forum is a great place to air views and comment, do we not think this has turned into a bun fight.

 

Yes a good point in parts, but this forum has proven itself to be a well rounded bunch and agree there appears to be a different than usual sentiment to this thread the past few days, however what you may of missed is there has been for a good while, a level of underlying discontent among both members with broken engines after mapping and observers too, what this thread had done is merely to make available an airing of those concerns, the particular tuner involved in some mapping has created a niche for himself but in the view of many has implemented it badly, this with broken dreams and reported bad customer service has led to a venting of understandable frustration.

 

Jeff

 

you don't "know very well", I'm afraid, only what someone else has told you. The owner didn't spend a lot on new parts, and subsequently the car was written off before further testing was completed.

 

QUOTE]

 

Wrong - I have spoken with this person directly several times, and in my book New Maf, IACV (Idle Air Control Valve), Pipe work and sensors aren't cheap parts.

 

 

Correct the car was written off, but only once the Selin and your map had been replaced with a standalone ECU setup. The owner had become disillusioned with you failing to sort/find the issue & 'blindly' asking him to change out perfectly good parts for new Nissan items, whilst charging him for all of your speculative investigation work........ Jim on the other hand, didn't charge the guy a penny whilst fitting all of these items, as I'm sure he felt sorry for him.

 

At not one point did I advise that new items should be purchased, or in fact needed to be. I still have our entire correspondence saved for reference. The car was never with me, I had to travel 130 miles each way to Bristol to get to the car. The car was originally mapped 25th June 2013, with no issues whatsoever with a completely different setup. I spent a long time with the car on a couple of occasions, and the last time charged nothing, not even for fuel & travel. The investigation into the issues was done at the owner's behest, in conjunction with discussions with SZ. The task was to get to the bottom of the stalling issue. The eventual solution: A Standalone ECU apparently. That says something. There are other options, though. Again, I didn't build the car or specify the components.

 

When all is said and done, you have had numerous issues with your car, detailed here in this thread. Issues that have had nothing to do with me whatsoever such as clutch, FPR, fuel pump, injector rail. I wasn't given the luxury of having the car on the dyno for mapping. I had to travel both times, and both times there were major problems. The second time being 20th September 2014, nearly 15 months ago. It has taken a very long time for your car to be ready for actual mapping.

 

I've been diplomatic about things on here regarding names, what's been said and things that have happened that people know nothing about.

 

Yes a good point in parts, but this forum has proven itself to be a well rounded bunch and agree there appears to be a different than usual sentiment to this thread the past few days, however what you may of missed is there has been for a good while, a level of underlying discontent among both members with broken engines after mapping and observers too, what this thread had done is merely to make available an airing of those concerns, the particular tuner involved in some mapping has created a niche for himself but in the view of many has implemented it badly, this with broken dreams and reported bad customer service has led to a venting of understandable frustration.

 

Jeff

 

Ok, you've had plenty of say now. "Broken engines after mapping"? How about badly put together engines and components prior to mapping? One of yours: http://www.300zx.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?181830-didnt-expect-this

 

You sent that car out with no air filter, a massive oil leak, low compression and a horrific exhaust you created.

 

You commenting on this thread is comical, given the huge amount of issues you have caused people in the past.

 

But that is exactly what you have done :confused1:..... ok whatever.

 

Jeff

 

No, it isn't. You've used this thread as your own personal soapbox for a little too long.

 

 

A build thread from start to finish like this is actually a good indication of what can be involved. I've long been saying that mapping/building these cars is an absolute nightmare. Look at the timescales, the issues, the setbacks, now the acrimony. This is what can be involved with a 300zx build. I have mapped so many of these cars now, close to 100, and I can probably count on one hand the cars that arrived with no problems and all sensors set correctly. I am usually the final person to sign off on anything & everything that may go wrong, as mapping should be the final task in hand. When it isn't, as in this case, there has typically been a problem. Or several problems. It reminds me of GibsonTT's thread, but that ended in breaking the car.

 

The kicker is that I wasn't able to sign off on the cars mentioned in this thread, due to various mechanical setbacks and the logistics of time, distance etc.

 

To highlight: I first created a basemap for this car on 11/06/2014. The first mapping session took place on 09/08/2014 and the map itself is titled: Howard 2 after FPR issues.bin. So nearly 2 years ago the car wasn't ready for mapping, yet I had travelled a total of around 450 miles in order to map it (Leicester-Bristol-Surrey-Bristol-Leicester). The "issue" that the filename refers to was an eBay FPR that wasn't holding pressure on boost. Probably a £30 part.

You make it sound like you never got paid Noel, I remember paying you £800 odd pounds for you to map the car and come down to Surrey.

 

The FPR was bought second hand from a club memeber on here when it developed a fault/leaking diaphragm it was replaced with an AEM unit.

 

The huge time gap between when you started and when the map was done just this week, isn't due to the number of issues, I mean it's not like Jimmer is just a quick 10 mins down the road from me, or that he can fit me in anytime I like. As we all know here performance parts mainly come from the US and there not cheap the time you add shipping and VAT. As my car isn't my DD I SORN it for 6 months of the year. so I'm sure it won't surprise anyone that, yes these thing take a long time when put together.

 

At the end of the day Selin/mapping/stalling/ FPR/leaky injector/clutch issues aren't the issue, why I walked away from you and your services. You promised to carry out work and help Jim with the labour involved in stripping and rebuilding my engine after the HG went, along with promise made to me regarding future mapping of the car when ready. You shrugged your shoulders and walked away from it.

 

I paid for new HG, new Pistons, and Jim did the strip and rebuild for free.

 

You did a did absolutely nothing, end of.

Can i ask that the parties ONLY, involved, reply.

 

Any other digs not related to this particular thread will be deleted.

 

By leaving the thread open allows those involved to air their grievances and hopefully get answers to aid in resolving the issue, others jumping in with comments is not necessary unless directly involved or affected.

 

The whole thread can be copied and tidied up if requested.

 

Many thanks

Thanks Graham

Can i ask that the parties ONLY, involved, reply.

 

Thank you.

I've been an avid reader of this forum for over 13 years but rarely post. As I have been referenced in this post, I feel I should offer a little clarity.

 

During the past 16 years of Z ownership, I have been fortunate enough to deal with a number of professional vendors. Jim, Jeff, Mike at MJP, Danny at DTA, JD, AndyP, Greg at SZ all come to mind. Some of these business relationships have developed in to valued friendships over the years.

 

My "mapping" journey started in the late 90's/early 00's by experimenting with generic JWT, SE Nistech, JD and DTA chips. AndyP even created a switchable dual map for me back in the day. These were all good fun when used in conjunction with my very basic mods. Fast forward, and Ed at Fusion Motorsport fitted a Nistune board and mapped the car to complement some additional mild mods that I had installed. This served me well for a number of years. Following a change in injectors, the car was remapped by Noel. Fast forward again and after extensive dialogue with Greg at SZ, I ordered some high end hardware and had it all professionally installed by Jim. This included extensive breather mods, a dual MAF set up and a Selin unit. The car was again sent to Noel for mapping. The remit was drivability over crazy horsepower.

 

Upon receiving and testing the car after mapping, a number of issues were immediately evident. It idled very high, 1250 - 1350rpm, the engine cut out intermittently under heavy load/braking, it over fuelled and after each stall it would crank but not start until the fuel pump relay was pulled and cranked again. I had a few interesting moments when approaching junctions and roundabouts! Has anyone tried steering a Z on a roundabout without power? Despite my remit, the map was set up for high end power at the expense of low/mid range drivability. It felt heavy and laggy. Noel did not have his own premises at the time, so the car went back to Bristol for him and Jim to examine. This is where months of experimentation started.

 

The restarting issue was a mapping/fuelling issue and quickly corrected by Noel adjusting the map. However, the car still stalled frequently and the idle remained high making it undrivable. Despite Conzult being clear, the faults were initially blamed on mechanical issues. Notwithstanding the Conzult results, and after a lot of unsuccessful diagnostics by Noel, I ordered and had installed various new components and sensors to eliminate any mechanical related issues, including new MAF's, PTU, TPS, CAS, IACV and fuelling components. Still the issues persisted and Noel then blamed the Selin unit/increased airflow as the proximate cause for the issues. A weird pipe contraption was even fabricated to attempt to cure the problems. This completely defeated the whole purpose of the Selin unit and failed to address the issues. Meanwhile, I was paying for all the experimental work. Then blame was placed on my HID's interfering with the Selin Units. Mine was a Series 2 which had an improved housing to eliminate such interference. Jim had access to other Selin units (Series 1 and Series 2) but using these did not resolve the issues either. I even contacted Jim Selin himself and he kindly offered to send me a new unit free of charge but felt that it was a mapping issue. I felt completely insulted when I was finally told by Noel that I could potentially live with the issues as the car was able to be started after stalling! It was at this time that I started to hear about other people having issues, including Howard.

 

Feeling frustrated, I turned to Greg at SZ and after some 50+ email exchanges, he concluded that it was a mapping issue. He had mapped a 100+ Z's with the Selin without any issues. He asked if he could see my map but Noel objected to sending him the file, stating that it was his intellectual property. Greg then sent me one of his maps free of charge to experiment with but Noel had no success with this either. Each time Noel travelled to Bristol to look at my car, I was charged petrol and time whilst Jim was kind enough to store my car for several months and undertook a lot of mechanical/experimentation work free of charge for Noel in an effort to assist me. It is also important to state that Noel's own car was with Jim at the time for TOTB preparation. So work on my car was purely incidental to him checking/doing work on his own car when in Bristol. I felt the total mapping spend was excessive and achieved nothing. I also felt let down when communication with Noel became difficult and if I'd had the time and inclination, I would have pursued him for a full refund. Several text/voice messages were ignored and unanswered. In the end, it was clear that he could not resolve the issues and had no interest to help me. We are all faced with challenges but as a vendor, it is important to either deal with the issues professionally or be honest and upfront with the customer. I could not use my car for 3+ months as a result of these failures.

 

Disheartened, and significantly out of pocket, I spoke to three other mappers and was reassured that the issues could be resolved without eliminating the dual MAF/Selin set up. To my relief, this was successfully achieved with the original set up and with Nistune in situ just to prove that the issues were map related and not mechanical. No more stalling and no more high idle. I subsequently installed a Link G4+ because I wanted to remove the MAF's altogether and change to a MAP sensor set up. This allowed for greater optimisation of my set up and the result was absolutely awesome. Sadly, a little mishap on a wet, twisty B road resulted in the car being sent to Z heaven.

 

One final point. I was hugely impressed by the facilities and preparation time taken by the last two mappers I have used. Hours were spent checking and re-checking the mechanical soundness of the car before even thinking about placing it on the dyno. This included a compression test, smoke test for boost leaks, timing alignment, fuel pressure test, spark plug gapping, proper boost controller set up and road tests. Even the rear tyre threads and pressures were checked and adjusted. All of these measures gives one a huge level of confidence in the mapper and the mapping session. Greg at Protuner mapped an F-Con ECU in my current Z in this very manner. Jim knows this car very well. After importation, it went straight from the port to him for a thorough check and some work. I was flattered when he gave me a detailed assessment of the car, stating that it was one of the best Z's he had driven. Therefore, I was somewhat nervous about handing it over to a mapper, fearing that the drivability would be compromised in some way. However, it had to be set up properly for UK fuel and so off it went to Greg. He is a perfectionist, listens carefully to the client's needs and maps accordingly. We spent a long time talking about my driving style and what I wanted to achieve. We started at 10.30am and finished at 12.30am the next day. There was constant dialogue and feedback throughout the session. 4-5 hours were spent alone in pre-dyno checks and adjustments and I think he must have made 40 to 50 runs on the dyno until he was completely satisfied with the map. The cost remained as was agreed from the outset and I guess it is for these reasons that one has to wait some 3 months for a booking with him. The final result - a very responsive and progressive power band with plenty of low/midrange grunt. I had no interest in the HP output or seeing the dyno chart. It's all about drivability on the road for me without compromising reliability. So next time you're considering a mapper, ask yourself - what exactly are you getting for your outlay?

 

I know this is a long post but felt that a little clarity was required to some of the foregoing comments. My comments may be challenged but I have no desire to enter in to a debate. It is what it is.

 

Happy Zedding.

Sahid, nicely put together and an interested read nice one.

 

Jeff

Shahid, thanks for taking the time to write up your side of the story. Look forward to catching up.

 

Hope your enjoying your new Zed now at last?

 

Hope your enjoying your new Zed now at last?

 

I am indeed, Sir, and hope you are too.

Interesting thread this. Although my car seems fine, It has made me worry a little.

Interesting thread this. Although my car seems fine, It has made me worry a little.

 

Provided you do not drive it like you stole it or running silly high boost / power levels it will be fine.

 

 

Jeff